[gwnn]

2♦-X-2♥-2♠

2♦ showed an undisciplined major suit preempt
X showed a weak NT or a good good hand
2♥ was p/c

What should 2♠ be? What percentage of weak NT's are licensed to bid over it?

If 2♠ is purely competitive, how do you bid an invite with spades or a GF with spades?

[gnasher]

2♠ is just competitive opposite the weak notrump, so only an unusually suitable weak notrump should move.

It's sensible to play the same methods here as after 1NT (2H), so either Lebensohl or Rubensohl would apply.

[OleBerg]

gnasher, on Sep 22 2008, 09:46 AM, said:

2♠ is just competitive opposite the weak notrump, so only an unusually suitable weak notrump should move.

It's sensible to play the same methods here as after 1NT (2H), so either Lebensohl or Rubensohl would apply.

Generally agree.

At MP's you need a very good hand to move, normally including four-card support.

At IMP's, 2♠ should show a little, but still be non-forcing. A weak nt with 3-card support should pass more often than not.

Agree with the Leben/Ruben considerations.

[helene_t]

Well Lebensohl must be modified since we need to be able to play in hearts.

[Ant590]

And I presume most play dbl as t/o? (after 2♥)

[ewj]

Yeh, Leb over 2H. double take out.

So I play 3x as forcing here too.


If you have lots of hearts, you can just pass and wait for them to bid 2S or for p to make a take out double I suppose.

[lowerline]

In this situation: (2♦)-dbl-(2♥)-?

You can play double as takeout for hearts (8+); 2NT as forcing to game; any suit bid as natural but not forcing (but showing some values, because very weak hands can pass).

[OleBerg]

ewj, on Sep 22 2008, 11:46 AM, said:

If you have lots of hearts, you can just pass and wait for them to bid 2S or for p to make a take out double I suppose.

Unless they pass 2♥ with spades. Least unlikely, when they are favourable.

[glen]

gwnn, on Sep 22 2008, 03:38 AM, said:

... If 2♠ is purely competitive, how do you bid an invite with spades or a GF with spades?

Yes, just competitive - with invite+ double, Stayman, or transfer as below:

From ACBL Defense #2:

(2♦) DBL (2M) ?
(where 2M is P/C)
DBL = BAL, at least INV values; if FG stopper only in bid major. Does not deny a 4-card major
2♠ = natural
2NT forces 3♣; signoff or FG w/ minor
3♣ = Stayman, FG, continuations as after 2NT-3♣
3♦ or 3♥ = Transfers, at least INV
3♠ = Both minors, FG
3NT = 11-15 HCP, stopper in both majors
4 of a minor = Strong invitation
4M = natural
4NT = Blackwood

[the hog]

X showed a weak NT? Change the methods.

[paulg]

The_Hog, on Sep 23 2008, 12:04 PM, said:

X showed a weak NT? Change the methods.

Comfortably the most popular defence in the UK (perhaps 12-16 for some).

Paul

[han]

It may not be the best defense but surely when you have a weak notrump it is nice to be playing this.

[fred]

gwnn, on Sep 22 2008, 07:38 AM, said:

What should 2♠ be? What percentage of weak NT's are licensed to bid over it?

2S says "If you have a weak notrump we are playing in 2S". IMO the % of weak notrumps that are licensed to bid over it is very small (zero?). If there exists a weak notrump that should act, there is only one bid that such a hand can make: 3S.

The auction is analogous to:

1NT-2H-2S (where 2H is an overcall and where the range of 1NT is not relevant)

Quote

If 2♠ is purely competitive, how do you bid an invite with spades or a GF with spades?

Reasonable to play that a jump to 3S is forcing and that DBL (responsive) followed by a spade bid is invitational.

IMO the concept of using the initial DBL to be roughly 13-15 and roughly balanced or some strong hand is a good one, but it is obviously smart to make some agreements about the (many) possible ways the auction might continue.

Fred Gitelman
Bridge Base Inc.
www.bridgebase.com

[OleBerg]

gwnn, on Sep 22 2008, 09:38 AM, said:

X showed a weak NT or a good good hand

A well-tested defence in Denmark too, where multi has enjoyed 25 years of popularity.

(Personally I prefer it to be 12-16 and no good bid, thus a Marmic or a semibalanced hand with 5 cards in a minor-suit, can make a double too.)