[hrothgar]

The Christian Science Monitor has a decent article

http://www.csmonitor...oeu.html?page=1

[mike777]

This report seems to say Russia has taken Western half not eastern half.


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080811/ap_on_...a_south_ossetia

"Georgia claims Russians have cut country in half"



"Russian troops roll into western Georgia, taking control of several towns and a military base"

[mike777]

"http://www.csmonitor.com/2008/0812/p01s08-woeu.html?page=2"


I get the sinking feeling you could substitute many parts of the USA, and many other parts of the world for " South Ossetia" in this story....try substituting the words Texas, or California or almost any other state in the USA or the UK or Canada, etc in this story

[Mbodell]

mike777, on Aug 11 2008, 04:26 AM, said:

Yes, many sides....

Here in USA the big stories were an American Football player changing teams, and an American politician cheating on his wife.

Most Americans are not even sure if Georgia or South Ossetia is in Asia or Europe.
Is Europe/China/India/Turkey doing anything? You are alot closer and know the terrain and culture better than us.
Gerben, being much closer than us to the situation what do you recommend?

You'd think Americans would know more about Georgia given that it is the country with the 3rd most troops in Iraq. You'd think that would help mandate a little more US support to an attack on their country than "we'd prefer that all sides reach peace".

[jtfanclub]

Mbodell, on Aug 11 2008, 03:48 PM, said:

You'd think that would help mandate a little more US support to an attack on their country than "we'd prefer that all sides reach peace".

The folks in the only big city in Ossetia found out the cease fire was broken when Georgia sent shells into apartment complexes in the middle of the night. The number of innocent civillians who died was comparable to 9/11.

You'd think that sending 2000 soldiers into Iraq would not make activity like this U.S. Approved.

[mike777]

Mbodell, on Aug 11 2008, 03:48 PM, said:

mike777, on Aug 11 2008, 04:26 AM, said:

Yes, many sides....

Here in USA the big stories were an American Football player changing teams, and an American politician cheating on his wife.

Most Americans are not even sure if Georgia or South Ossetia is in Asia or Europe.
Is Europe/China/India/Turkey doing anything? You are alot closer and know the terrain and culture better than us.
Gerben, being much closer than us to the situation what do you recommend?

You'd think Americans would know more about Georgia given that it is the country with the 3rd most troops in Iraq. You'd think that would help mandate a little more US support to an attack on their country than "we'd prefer that all sides reach peace".

1) I doubt many Americans except a few policy wonks or newshog readers have any idea how many troops other countries contribute.
2) My guess is Americans can tell you alot more about Bret Farve story or cheating Politician story than can you tell you anything about the culture, politics or terrain of Georgia. I know for a fact the entire state of Wisconsin seemed to call my Wife this weekend and none of the talk was about Mother Russia. With Monday night football tonight(Packers) they again will be on the phone all night long...ugg..
3) I think some Americans will hear this story and think GA. has been invaded..hmmm I wonder if that will affect football down in the deep South this fall?
4) With the Monday Night football and the Monday night Olympics....sad to say most of us have no idea what is going on in that conflict or why.

[kenberg]

hrothgar, on Aug 11 2008, 01:15 PM, said:

The Christian Science Monitor has a decent article

http://www.csmonitor...oeu.html?page=1

Very useful. Thank you.

[Aberlour10]

What did Mr Sakashvilli think on the night to friday as his forces openend massive fire with heavy weapons to South Ossetia?. There were russian peace keepers (stationed since cease-fire agreement of 1992) under this heavy fire, many of them died, much more civilians died, the town of Tskhinvali was completely destroyed.
US would immediately punish everybody who starts to kill their soldiers and citizens ,the Russians do it too.


Robert

[Winstonm]

If you or your ally were planning a military strike against Iran, it would make sense to enlist the help of Georgia to draw the attention of Russia and its military.

[kenberg]

Mike has suggested (more than suggested) that most Americans don't have a clear grasp of what is going on. I am not all that surprised to find myself among them.

Still, it's a democracy here and so I must try to have an opinion. It's a work in progress.

The CSM article was interesting to me. But now I am wondering more than before: Why was it seen as a good idea to have Georgia be part of NATO? I never heard of South Ossetia. My spell checker never heard of South Ossetia. But it appears there is some seriously unsettled business there. Does someone in the State Department, where they presumably know more than I do, have a decent understanding of what we are getting into here? We don't need to be committing more troops to someplace where the main objective of most people is to kill their neighbors.

Maybe Mr. Bush should go take another look into Mr. Putin's soul.

[mike777]

I hope I have also suggested this looks like a great time to follow the lead of countries/Europe who are located close by and know a heck of alot more about the politics, culture and terrain.

Good time for our allies in Europe/China/Turkey and India to show us how it should be done as we follow.

At this point in time I hope you guys and gals there can post what your leadership suggests.

Yes we all want peace....and peace now!

[Aberlour10]

It is very hard to get objective, independed and confirmed informations about what exactly is going on in the conflict zone at the moment. From one side Moscows desinformation campaign, from the other Mr Sakashvilli's personally propaganda every full hour on CNN, BBC etc.

For sure is only one: Truth is first victim of this war.

Robert

[Winstonm]

Here is a rather even-handed look at this conflict from theguardian

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/20.../georgia.russia

[bb79]

Here is a news about Turkey's point of view:

Turkey proposes the formation of a Caucasian union to resolve conflicts

[helene_t]

mike777, on Aug 12 2008, 01:39 AM, said:

Good time for our allies in Europe/China/Turkey and India to show us how it should be done as we follow.

At this point in time I hope you guys and gals there can post what your leadership suggests.

I am happy that you are interested in our opinions. However, it will take some two or three years for the EU/WEU/OSCE/EC/etc bureaucracies to formulate a POV and sorting out how to pay the bills. Hopefully by that time the crisis will be over.

[sceptic]

helene_t, on Aug 12 2008, 10:37 AM, said:

mike777, on Aug 12 2008, 01:39 AM, said:

Good time for our allies in Europe/China/Turkey and India to show us how it should be done as we follow.

At this point in time I hope you guys and gals there can post what your leadership suggests.

I am happy that you are interested in our opinions. However, it will take some two or three years for the EU/WEU/OSCE/EC/etc bureaucracies to formulate a POV and sorting out how to pay the bills. Hopefully by that time the crisis will be over.

I think you are seriously understimating Europes ability to drag it out before they have to make the wrong decision

[Al_U_Card]

kenberg, on Aug 11 2008, 07:22 PM, said:

Maybe Mr. Bush should go take another look into Mr. Putin's soul.

Hmmmnnn

So that he might be able to get a few pointers on despotism and running a country by fiat?

So that he wouldn't have to fabricate all kinds of "information" and "evidence" about WMD's and terrorist support to justify (ie pull the wool over the eyes of the aspects of governance that are still left) blatant militarism?

So that he could find another soul as black as his own?

The last one is not fair, as you can't blame the puppet for his movements...

[jdonn]

I have been LOVING the white house's quotes about this. I think my favorite came from John McCain. From CNN, 'Russia's actions, [McCain] said, must be submitted to "the court of world opinion."' Lol, Mr. Pot I would like you to meet Mr. Kettle.

[blackshoe]

White House? Since when does McCain speak from — or for — the White House?

[jdonn]

blackshoe, on Aug 12 2008, 03:47 PM, said:

White House? Since when does McCain speak from — or for — the White House?

Who says he does? More importantly, why do you even make these posts?