[kfay]

Scoring: IMP

1NT-3♠
3NT-?

3♠ shows 1=3(54).

---

[Echognome]

I think this is worth a slam invite. I think I would just give it yee old 4NT. 4♦ is a possibility if partner will understand.

[inquiry]

4♦ = let partner know what is what, and we still have slam interest. I would give up if partner bids 4NT over this.

[Fluffy]

4♦, partner will let us knwo if we are on a real missfit.

[kenrexford]

I'm confused. It looks like you bid 3♠ for the sole purpose of finding out if your spade Queen was acarrying its weight. A great bid, IMO. With a lesser hand, you would presumably have taken a less interesting route; with a greater hand you presumably would have taken a more interesting route. However, with this exact hand, you took the perfect route of the 3♠ call.

Now, partner announces that your spade Queen is carrying full weight.

WTP? Bid 4♦ like you planned. Perfect auction!

[nige1]

kfay, on Jul 8 2008, 02:53 PM, said:

Scoring: IMP

1NT-3♠
3NT-?
3♠ shows 1=3(54).

---

IMO 4♦ (if forcing)=10, 4N=9, _P=5.

[jdonn]

Anything but 4♦ is wrong imo. What else can it show?

[655321]

4♦, certainly if 3♠ showed exactly 13(54).

I guess if you could have other shapes, including longer diamonds, there is a case for 4NT instead.

[han]

4D.

[skjaeran]

Jlall, on Jul 8 2008, 10:19 PM, said:

I would go 4D which shows our shape and slam interest. We might just have slam on power as partner could just have a 17 count or w/e. 3N doesn't necessarily show slam unsuitable, just spades well stopped. This makes me think my SQ wil be useful.

Agree!

[benlessard]

Quote

We might just have slam on power as partner could just have a 17 count or w/e. 3N doesn't necessarily show slam unsuitable, just spades well stopped. This makes me think my SQ wil be useful.

I disagree. For me 3S is more a slammish bid then a COG bid. 13(45) hand that are not strong enough to hope to make 5m often should just bid 3Nt . If you hope to make 5m often then you have at least some slight slam interest. So if partner is not minimum and has no S wastage he should never bid 3Nt. That hand is tricky since the K of S might be useful to discard the 3rd heart. But still i prefer to pass 3Nt.

[andy_h]

Easy 4D. I have a pretty hot hand so I will now show my shape and interest.

[Hanoi5]

I wouldn't have bid 3♠.

[skjaeran]

Hanoi5, on Jul 9 2008, 09:48 PM, said:

I wouldn't have bid 3♠.

Why?

[kenrexford]

skaeran, on Jul 9 2008, 05:29 PM, said:

Hanoi5, on Jul 9 2008, 09:48 PM, said:

I wouldn't have bid 3♠.

Why?

I can hazard a guess.

The 3♠ call, more so than the 3♥ corollary, jams the auction for our side. Whereas a 3♥ call allows a 3♠ bid to set spades as trumps and start nice cuebidding unwind auctions, or a bleck 4♠, a 3♠ call leaves no real good solution for agreeing hearts. Thus, 3♠ is usually (best?) handled with a tighter range.

With something outside of that normal range, you might opt Puppet Stayman (often part of a scheme that has this 3♠ meaning) or MSS. With a weakish hand, for example, you might bid Puppet and then accept 3NT unless partner shows no four OR five-card major.

This hand is strange, in that the spade Queen messes up the analysis, and the range may be wrong for the established expectation of the 3♠ call.

For me, personally, I like 3♠ because the range is right for when partner declines 3NT (where the spade Queen loses value) and because opting 3NT kicks me into a different range appropriate for not passing 3NT.

In other words, if partner bids, say, 4♣, then my 14-count with a stiff spade looks right. If, however, parter bids 3NT, my 16-count with a stiff spade looks right for the over-ride bid. But, that same analysis might not work with a different-range 3♠ expectancy.

Of course, I may be way off as to the reasons.

[benlessard]

Quote

For me, personally, I like 3♠ because the range is right for when partner declines 3NT (where the spade Queen loses value) and because opting 3NT kicks me into a different range appropriate for not passing 3NT.

I think exactly the opposite.

Lets say the bidding goes

1Nt----3S
4D

is 4D forcing ? or its show a minimum hand with no S stopper ? For me 3S is absolute Gf. So 4m is the stongest bid available. & 3Nt showing a stopper is the least encouraging and weakest bid. Give partner any hand with xxx in S and there is a slamwh. The only hande where slam is unlikely is when partner has AJxx, AKxx, KJxx etc in S.

On aside note do you play that

1Nt----(P)------3S------(x) asking for a H lead ?

1Nt----(P)------3S------(P)
3Nt----(P)------P-------(x) asking for a m lead ?

[gnasher]

benlessard, on Jul 11 2008, 06:34 AM, said:

On aside note do you play that

1Nt----(P)------3S------(x) asking for a H lead ?

With 3NT still a possible contract, I think double should ask for a spade lead.