[rbforster]

Consider the following auction where the opponents pass initially and then bid naturally over opener's 1NT rebid -

1m - (P) - 1M - (P)
1N - (2X) - ?

What would my actions be here as responder? Specifically, what is double and what actions show an invitational hand? If it would make things more concrete, consider this auction in particular:

1♦-(P)- 1♠-(P)
1N - (2♦) -?

[Codo]

There are different possibilities. But I prefer to play always take out doubles as long as it is not defined different.
So the default meaning for me is take out, but I doubt that this will be the majority view.

[andy_h]

I haven't had much discussion about these sorts of auctions with my partner, mainly because you wouldn't expect it to come up as it usually only occurs amongst weaker players. But then when you do get these auctions, you're sometimes stumped because you don't know what your bids mean now! Funny that. My partner and I just have the general principles of lots of T/O doubles. As we would still treat it like a normal overcall, bidding a new suit is forcing.

[Sambolino]

andy_h, on Jun 23 2008, 09:05 AM, said:

I haven't had much discussion about these sorts of auctions with my partner, mainly because you wouldn't expect it to come up as it usually only occurs amongst weaker players.

2d is a normal bidding action which will occur at any level of play, but is somewhat rare tho


i think it's healthy to play it as pen

[andy_h]

Sambolino, on Jun 24 2008, 12:29 AM, said:

andy_h, on Jun 23 2008, 09:05 AM, said:

I haven't had much discussion about these sorts of auctions with my partner, mainly because you wouldn't expect it to come up as it usually only occurs amongst weaker players.

2d is a normal bidding action which will occur at any level of play, but is somewhat rare tho

Yes, I was moreorless (tried) referring to the 1m-1M-1NT-(2x) sort of auctions, because they passed up the 1st time at a low level but comes in at the 2lvl. And normally 1 would not have a direct 2D over 1D as a natural bid.

I had a rare auction that came up a while ago now which was very similar.
(1♠) - p - (1NT)* - p
(2♥) - 2♠

1NT = forcing. My partner bid the 2S, and it seemed a bit strange as he was bidding an opponent's 5card Major. I finally concluded that it was natural, though it's pretty weird but yeah it was indeed natural.

This also brought about some interesting (?) auctions that was up in discussion;
(1♠) - p - (2♥) - 4H vs 4S vs 4NT

[Sambolino]

andy_h, on Jun 23 2008, 09:55 AM, said:

This also brought about some interesting (?) auctions that was up in discussion;
(1♠) - p - (2♥) - 4H vs 4S vs 4NT

4M must be nat here

[jtfanclub]

Sambolino, on Jun 23 2008, 10:06 AM, said:

andy_h, on Jun 23 2008, 09:55 AM, said:

This also brought about some interesting (?) auctions that was up in discussion;
(1♠) - p - (2♥) - 4H vs 4S vs 4NT

4M must be nat here

You would have a hard time convincing me that 4♠ was possible. Although I can't think of any other meaning for the bid. Maybe an extreme minor two suiter in which the suits aren't equal (so it leaves 4NT available for 'no preference).

4♥ has got to be natural, since opp could be throwing in a garbage bid on the way to 4♠ to confuse the opps.

P.S. Thanks for explaining your X on the earlier discussion.