[karlson]

x Axxx AKJxx Axx

1st seat opens 2s. You double, and partner tries 2N (edit: standard lebensohl agreements).

Enough for 3d? Do colors and scoring matter?

[ArtK78]

Is 2NT Lebensohl? If so, 3♣ is enough. Partner might be broke.

If 2NT is not Lebensohl then you should bid 3♦.

[pclayton]

I'll squeeze out 3♦. Its only patently wrong when pard has a real bust with 5 clubs and 3♣ is the limit.

[fromageGB]

3♣ all the time. LHO is unlimited, partner is marked with useless spades, playing in ♦ means you are ruffing in the long hand, playing in ♣ (if that is his suit) is much better.

Also if he bids ♥ (why not ?) you'd kick yourself if partner passed a 3♦ bid, thinking you had a strong hand in diamonds.

[Echognome]

I think it's close. So many controls! But I'll stick with the chicken 3♣ for now. I still don't know p's intentions on the hand. 3♦ for me would show an additional Q for me in one of the suits besides spades.

[Halo]

3D

I doubled showing hearts, and I have a really good hand and really good diamonds.

[jdonn]

3♣ for me, if you call partner's range 0-8 then our combined range is 17-24, so I don't see why this is a problem. Sure our hand is nice, but if partner passes then we are our worst suit anyway, and if he bids another suit we can decide to raise then.

[gnasher]

jdonn, on Apr 9 2008, 09:57 PM, said:

3♣ for me, if you call partner's range 0-8 then our combined range is 17-24, so I don't see why this is a problem. Sure our hand is nice, but if partner passes then we are our worst suit anyway, and if he bids another suit we can decide to raise then.

Me too.

[karlson]

I thought it was reasonably close, but also went with 3♣. Partner passed and tabled AT9x xx xx QTxxx. I was very happy to avoid 3N, but since it was destined to make on the layout, I was a bit worried (it was teams, short matches).

Another Q seems like an easy 3♦. I don't see why this should cause me to miss hearts when partner has them.

[Fluffy]

I have minimum values!

[matmat]

karlson, on Apr 9 2008, 06:04 PM, said:

I thought it was reasonably close, but also went with 3♣. Partner passed and tabled AT9x xx xx QTxxx. I was very happy to avoid 3N, but since it was destined to make on the layout, I was a bit worried (it was teams, short matches).

Another Q seems like an easy 3♦. I don't see why this should cause me to miss hearts when partner has them.

you mean p didn't make a penalty pass with AT9x?

3♣ for me too... it's not like i have substantial extras or a self-sufficient suit. why distort the hand?

[Apollo81]

Agree with Josh, 3♣ and dont see this as that tough a call

[Free]

3♣

[whereagles]

I'm gonna risk a 3♦ bid.

[655321]

Agree with 3♣, but I do think it is quite close, and would not criticize 3♦.

[skjaeran]

3♣ for me, and I don't think it's really close.

[Trinidad]

3♣, not close. Partner is about 0-7 in my book, so I will need considerably more to bid something other than 3♣.

Rik

[neilkaz]

3♣ for me, wanting just a bit more for 3♦

[jdonn]

I still agree with 3♣ but in fairness there is one good argument for 3♦ that I don't think has been mentioned. If partner is 3-4 or 4-4 in the minors then we reach a better suit (though likely at a higher level?)

[awm]

Am I the only one who likes to use 3♦ artificial in this auction?

Suppose you have a "normal takeout double" with a lot of extras, something like:

♠Ax
♥KQxx
♦AQx
♣AKxx

You could've bid 3NT, but you doubled because you want to find the potential 4-4 or 5-4 heart fit.

So you double and partner predictably bids 2NT lebensohl. This shows 0-7 or 0-8 or something, but much of that range is still enough for game opposite your hand. So you don't really want to bid 3♣ and hear partner pass. If you bid 3NT now, partner won't know if you have four hearts or three hearts or maybe even two hearts, so again you miss all those nice heart fits. Presumably 3♥ would show five hearts (and extras) and 3♠ is forcing but seems unlikely to induce partner to bid 3NT without a spade stopper when he has no major.

I like 3♦ as an artificial force to solve this problem -- partner bids 3♥ with a heart suit or 3NT with a spade stopper and no heart suit, or 3♠ lacking either. The only real loss is the "flexible hand with diamonds" where you can of course bid 3♦ anyway over lebensohl (it is forcing after all) or bid 3♠ if you have only three hearts and mostly want to get to 3NT if partner has a spade control.