[jdonn]

Background:
- I'm a casino accounting supervisor at Bellagio, a very large casino/hotel in Las Vegas.
- There is a type of tax form called 1099 that our department doesn't deal with and I honestly know very little about, but they are somehow filed by a different department here.
- Bellagio has a number called our Federal Tax ID number that is needed to fill out lots of different tax related paperwork. That I know and have easy access to.

This was my phone conversation just now...

ring ring ring
Me: Hello, this is Josh.
Phone: Hi this is member services, we have a tax preparer on the line who needs our federal tax ID number. Is that something you have that you can give over the phone?
Me: Sure I'll take them.
Phone: Thank you I'll transfer them over.
(20 seconds of dead silence on the phone as I await the transfer...)
Me: Hello, is anyone there?
Phone (different voice now): Hello??? Are you a little kid playing around on the phone or are you a supervisor like I asked for??
Me: I'm a supervisor, can I help you?
Phone: I'm a tax preparer doing your 1099s and you did not include your federal tax ID number, I need it right now.
Me: I have it right here, are you ready?
Phone: (5 seconds of silence) Start.
Me: It's blah blah dash blah blah blah
Phone: Blah blah dash blah blah blah?
Me: Yes that's right.
Phone: Now I suggest you follow federal law from now on and include your tax ID number on your 1099s. And I ALSO suggest you take a class in phone manners. Thank you! (click)
Me:

[Echognome]

It sounds like the funny part of the conversation occurred between the tax preparer and member services.

You should have told the dude to relax... he's got until April 15th...

[mycroft]

P,K,B? (meaning the tax preparer)

That's why whenever I transfer someone, I stay on the line and introduce them.

What it probably sounded like on the other end of the phone was

"Hold one, I will try to find someone for you"
[minute or two silence]
(other voice) "hello, is anyone there?"
...

However, if you haven't learned that There Are Arseholes Everywhere by now...
Nice rant.
Michael.

[jdonn]

I should have said "you sure have balls don't you maam" and seen what happened hehehe.

[1eyedjack]

Interested to know - what security checks did you perform on the caller to verify his bona fides? Or is this reference number something of no value to someone with malicious intent?

As an aside, I work in taxes in the UK and we often play a little game. Our tax authorities insist on dealing by telephone as much as possible but through justified paranoia launch a substantial barrage of security checks before talking to us, where we are the originators of the calls. (This is the organisation that managed to "lose" the entire nation's confidential data by sending unencrypted CD-ROMs through the post, never to be received - and that on more occasions than has been widely reported).

Funny thing is, when they call us first and we do the same on them, it takes them a bit by surprise. Often they are unable to prove their ID to our satisfaction and we agree to phone them back. But then gettinig the returned call routed to the right person is another nightmare.

[han]

Josh, how often have you mentioned having balls in the last 24 hours?

[barmar]

1eyedjack, a corporate tax ID number is not a big secret that needs to be protected. 1099's are sent to all contractors, and in the case of casinos, I think to all gamblers who win more than a certain amount of money. I think it might also be the same as the Employer Identification Number that's on every regular employee's W-2 form.

With so many thousands of people knowing their ID number, it's hardly necessary to do a security check when someone calls to get it so they can fill out their taxes.

[jdonn]

han, on Mar 25 2008, 02:08 PM, said:

Josh, how often have you mentioned having balls in the last 24 hours?

Dozens of times.

Barmar's post is exactly correct. It's not at all private information, although I'm still not about to post it here.

[joshs]

Its 666-4355

[kenberg]

Mostly I'm stunned by the apparent casualness of all of this. I gather the tax preparer is hired by the casino. An office of the casino forgot to supply needed information, the tax preparer called back some general member services number, member services called around here and there to see if anyone could supply the info, you said you could, although you have no direct involvement or responsibility with the tax preparer, some juvenile guy from the tax preparing office who needs to be fired is happy to take the information from whomever he talks to, etc.

This is the way things are done in the financial world? The current meltdown is becoming more comprehensible by the minute.

[whereagles]

josh, maybe the guy was Daniel Ocean???

[Echognome]

kenberg, on Mar 26 2008, 04:36 AM, said:

Mostly I'm stunned by the apparent casualness of all of this. I gather the tax preparer is hired by the casino. An office of the casino forgot to supply needed information, the tax preparer called back some general member services number, member services called around here and there to see if anyone could supply the info, you said you could, although you have no direct involvement or responsibility with the tax preparer, some juvenile guy from the tax preparing office who needs to be fired is happy to take the information from whomever he talks to, etc.

This is the way things are done in the financial world? The current meltdown is becoming more comprehensible by the minute.

1) The casino is a part of a huge corporation I'm sure. They will have their own accounting and tax departments, not hire some chump tax preparer. They will have an outside CPA firm to audit most likely.

2) If it was for the casino, then the tax preparer would have had to have all the information by March 15, not April 15 as corporations must file (or get a 6-month extension) by then.

3) What's for more plausible is that some individual won some money at the casino, hired some chump tax preparer and said preparer was calling up to get the numbers for their client's paperwork.

[jdonn]

Echognome, on Mar 26 2008, 10:24 AM, said:

3) What's for more plausible is that some individual won some money at the casino, hired some chump tax preparer and said preparer was calling up to get the numbers for their client's paperwork.

Bingo. I also know the person who did the original work, and I'd be willing to 100% guarantee it was done correctly and the information was provided, especially given who the opposing viewpoint comes from.

[helene_t]

Phone: GM, my name is Joe Doe from the statistics office. We received your financial report but we need some more details.
Me: OK.
Phone: What is your fax number?
Me: blahblahblah
Phone: What is your VAT number?
Me: blahblahblah
Phone: What is your SE number?
Me: blahblahblah
Phone: What is the social security number of the general manager?
Me: blahblahblah
Phone: What is the estate number of the company building?
Me: Sorry I don't have that one but you can have the frame number of my bicycle.

Phone: I installed your database engine but it cannot import my old FoxBase stuff.
Me: OK let me take your technical details. What OS are you running?
Phone: BlahBlah
Me: ODBC version?
Phone: Blahblah
Me: CPU?
Phone: I am not gonna waste my time telling you what bloody hardware I am using. All I want is for you to fix this bug in your bloody database engine.
Me: Sorry but it is company policy. We need these details for the registration of your request.
Phone: Company policy! My goodness! Why don't you go into politics, you would do a great job as a politician with all those fancy words you are able to spit out!
Me: That may be a good idea, I could probably earn a lot more than I do with this lousy callcenter job.

A peer of mine (another recent immigrant who also had to take this kind of silly work to be able to demonstrate to the immigration service that she was not in the Netherlands for some indecent reason) then send me this link:
http://forum.anothersite.co.uk/sfw-picture...t-syndrome.html

[kenberg]

jdonn, on Mar 26 2008, 11:24 AM, said:

Echognome, on Mar 26 2008, 10:24 AM, said:

3) What's for more plausible is that some individual won some money at the casino, hired some chump tax preparer and said preparer was calling up to get the numbers for their client's paperwork.

Bingo. I also know the person who did the original work, and I'd be willing to 100% guarantee it was done correctly and the information was provided, especially given who the opposing viewpoint comes from.

Ok. But this doesn't get to the question of why member services, or you yourself, didn't say "have the caller contact so and so who did the original work". And if the caller actually is posing as someone else and asking for financial data under false pretenses, whether you judge it as innocuous or not, it seems a phone call to the police is in order.

If the financial folks on this thread are ok with this approach then maybe it's ok, what do I know, but it seems to me to be one very strange way to run a business.

[jdonn]

kenberg, on Mar 26 2008, 12:48 PM, said:

Ok. But this doesn't get to the question of why member services, or you yourself, didn't say "have the caller contact so and so who did the original work". And if the caller actually is posing as someone else and asking for financial data under false pretenses, whether you judge it as innocuous or not, it seems a phone call to the police is in order.

If the financial folks on this thread are ok with this approach then maybe it's ok, what do I know, but it seems to me to be one very strange way to run a business.

Lol what the.... financial data? They were asking for information about as top secret as an address. POLICE!!!

Member services doesn't have a clue who did what, they were being asked a tax related question so transfered to the first department they found with 'accounting' in the name, and lo and behold I knew the answer. If you think it's good business to take an irate caller and pass them around from person to person to person, or leave them on hold for long periods of time as you figure out who the right person is, remind me not to call your business.

[luke warm]

jdonn, on Mar 26 2008, 01:08 PM, said:

If you think it's good business to take an irate caller and pass them around from person to person to person, or leave them on hold for long periods of time as you figure out who the right person is, remind me not to call your business.

well if you continually pass irate callers from person to person, ad infinitum, pretty soon you should only have callers with pleasant dispositions