[hrothgar]

IMPs
White versus Red
7 Board Swiss

You get dealt the following

♠ Q952
♥ A87532
♦ K2
♣ 7

For better or worse, you decide to pass in first seat. LHO passes and partner opens 2♥. RHO then doubles

Question 1: What's your call?

Question 2: Assume that you decide to respond 5♥.

LHO bids 5NT and RHO bids 6♣.

What do you do now?

[gwnn]

5♥, pass. they are allowed to overbid.

[whereagles]

After the dbl, I'd try a 3♣ psyche. If you're not allowed to psych on this event, I'd try 5♥ and pass 6♣.

[Apollo81]

I'd bid 6♥. Passing when 6♣ is cold (which it could easily be,so could 7♣) is a way bigger disaster than phantom sacrificing for 300-500.

[Codo]

I try 5 Heart followed by 6 Heart.

Normally I would jump as high as possible, but it had been psossible that they play 5 Spade or 5 Heart X, so I go for this target first.
After 6 Club I pay the insurance and bid 6. And hey, out of the blue pd even makes it with -, Kxxxxx,Axxx,xx

Well maybe his hand is a "little" different, but still the insurance fee is small compared to the possible swing opposite Jx,KQJxxx,xxx,xx

[ArtK78]

Never let the opponents buy the hand in an auction like this. I bid 6♥ over 6♣.

The real problem comes when and if the opponents bid 7♣.

[Cascade]

hrothgar, on Jan 16 2008, 02:28 AM, said:

IMPs
White versus Red
7 Board Swiss

You get dealt the following

♠ Q952
♥ A87532
♦ K2
♣ 7

For better or worse, you decide to pass in first seat. LHO passes and partner opens 2♥. RHO then doubles

Question 1: What's your call?

Question 2: Assume that you decide to respond 5♥.

LHO bids 5NT and RHO bids 6♣.

What do you do now?

This all illustrates why this is a 1♥ opening.

[hrothgar]

Cascade, on Jan 16 2008, 01:44 AM, said:

hrothgar, on Jan 16 2008, 02:28 AM, said:

IMPs
White versus Red
7 Board Swiss

You get dealt the following

♠ Q952
♥ A87532
♦ K2
♣ 7

For better or worse, you decide to pass in first seat.  LHO passes and partner opens 2♥.  RHO then doubles

Question 1:  What's your call?

Question 2:  Assume that you decide to respond 5♥. 

LHO bids 5NT and RHO bids 6♣.

What do you do now?

This all illustrates why this is a 1♥ opening.

Maybe you have the luxury of opening playing your preferred methods...
I do

However, for the weekend I was playing 2/1 game force with a sound opening style.

[mike777]

Just wonder if we are allowed to open 2h if playing sound style and then become silent?

Given my pass in OP I bid 6H at my second turn if allowed.

[Fluffy]

depends a lot of who opponents are, tempted to just bid 3♥.

Anyway if you had a shot at 5♥ it is game over for you, you risked and now hope for the best.

[655321]

(1) 5♥
(2) Pass

Apollo81, on Jan 15 2008, 09:34 AM, said:

I'd bid 6♥.  Passing when 6♣ is cold (which it could easily be,so could 7♣) is a way bigger disaster than phantom sacrificing for 300-500.

If 6♣ is making then yes, you want to bid 6♥.

But it is not correct that missing a good save is way bigger disaster than taking a phantom.
The IMP scale flattens the difference. For example, assume the other table plays in 6♣:
   (a) 6♣ is cold, and you miss a -300 sacrifice: You have lost 14 IMPS (-500 is 13 IMPs)
   (b) 6♣ is one down, and you take the -300 phantom: You have lost 9 IMPS (-500 is 12 IMPS)

So only if you are pretty confident 6♣ is cold do you want to save.

Incidentally on this particular hand, if 6 ♣ is cold you would not be surprised to lose 1 club, 2 diamonds, and at least 2 spades in 6♥, for 800+.

[Cascade]

hrothgar, on Jan 16 2008, 11:49 AM, said:

However, for the weekend I was playing 2/1 game force with a sound opening style.

I think opening this hand is a "sound opening style" ;-)

Seriously if it is not a 1♥ opening then I would open 2♥.

[Cascade]

hrothgar, on Jan 16 2008, 02:28 AM, said:

IMPs
White versus Red
7 Board Swiss

You get dealt the following

♠ Q952
♥ A87532
♦ K2
♣ 7

For better or worse, you decide to pass in first seat. LHO passes and partner opens 2♥. RHO then doubles

Question 1: What's your call?

I'd consider any of the following as possible calls:

Redouble

2NT if strong

3♣ Natural and Non-forcing

3NT

4♥

4NT RKCB

5♥

and maybe some others.

In my experience pre-empts tend to work at least as well as psyches but when I am not sure what level to pre-empt I am willing to psyche. (Although I am not completely sure what constitutes a psyche on this sort of auction - offering to play in 3NT or 3♣ or the like just seem like reasonable tactics to me.)

Of course there are many individual hands where a psyche will work better.

On this hand the right level will depend on exactly the distribution of the points around the table and the opponent's distribution. It is possible to imagine hands where 4♥ is right - they can't make anything (we might even have a heart to cash if hearts are one-one with partner having opened a five-card suit in third seat) and we can't make anything. Equally it is possible to imagine hands where 5♥ or even 6♥ are right. I usually don't like going to 5♥ without being pushed so I would probably bid 4♥. 4♥ has some advantages over 5♥. The opponents are more likely to bid the wrong game. If RHO has doubled with only three spades LHO may well introduce a four-card spade suit.

Quote

Question 2:  Assume that you decide to respond 5♥. 

LHO bids 5NT and RHO bids 6♣.

What do you do now?

I don't believe in pre-empting and then after the opponents have made their choice which might be wrong in bidding again and let them off the hook except if I have a very unusual hand. I am close here with six hearts but the fact that we are at favourable vul and partner was in 3rd seat diminishes that a little.

It would be better to consult partner somehow - although I cannot think how. Maybe a jump shift over 2♥ (X) could do that (sort of defensive splinter or fit-jump) or maybe 5♥ being relatively unusual says that - it offers partner a choice should the opponents bid six or 5♠. 5♥ though doesn't give partner much information on which to judge but perhaps it is an interesting idea.

[han]

Cascade, on Jan 15 2008, 09:36 PM, said:

Seriously if it is not a 1♥ opening then I would open 2♥.

Of course, how can you pass this at favorable?

I would also bid 5H and then 6H. I don't think that we are beating 6C more than half the time.

[pclayton]

Hannie, on Jan 15 2008, 07:43 PM, said:

Cascade, on Jan 15 2008, 09:36 PM, said:

Seriously if it is not a 1♥ opening then I would open 2♥.

Of course, how can you pass this at favorable?

I would also bid 5H and then 6H. I don't think that we are beating 6C more than half the time.

Same here. If you were going to bid only 5♥ the 1st time, I think you need to bid 6 here. 6 could be a good save against a game.

[whereagles]

Cascade, on Jan 15 2008, 10:44 PM, said:

hrothgar, on Jan 16 2008, 02:28 AM, said:

♠ Q952
♥ A87532
♦ K2
♣ 7

What do you do now?

This all illustrates why this is a 1♥ opening.

I am forced to agree, because I don't believe there's such a thing as a hand "too good for a weak 2, but too weak for a 1 bid."

So I gotta open 1 or 2♥. I prefer 1♥.

[hrothgar]

whereagles, on Jan 16 2008, 01:44 PM, said:

Cascade, on Jan 15 2008, 10:44 PM, said:

hrothgar, on Jan 16 2008, 02:28 AM, said:

♠ Q952
♥ A87532
♦ K2
♣ 7

What do you do now?

This all illustrates why this is a 1♥ opening.

I am forced to agree, because I don't believe there's such a thing as a hand "too good for a weak 2, but too weak for a 1 bid."

So I gotta open 1 or 2♥. I prefer 1♥.

The issue is not whether or not there are hands that are "too good for a weak 2, but too weak for a 1 bid". This statement pre-supposes that the your hand evaluation is doesn't include any metrics other than "strength"

Lets assume that you are playing a "standard" weak 2♥ opening bid.

This hand suffers from a number of flaws including

1. A side four card major
2. A weak trump suit
3. Significant defense

Change the hand slightly to

♠ 952
♥ AQ7532
♦ K2
♣ 72

and I think that a 2♥ opening is clear.

Make the hand

♠ 5432
♥ AQ7532
♦ K2
♣ 7

And I'm on the cusp.

This hand is a clear pass.

[whereagles]

hrothgar, on Jan 16 2008, 01:54 PM, said:

1. The issue is not whether or not there are hands that are "too good for a weak 2, but too weak for a 1 bid".  This statement pre-supposes that the your hand evaluation is doesn't include any metrics other than "strength"

2. Lets assume that you are playing a "standard" weak 2♥ opening bid.

1. I don't quite understand where you're trying to get at, but my point is this: I believe a 6M-carder on the 9-11 zone should be opened either 1M or 2M. That's all.

2. Obviously, if you're going to follow what I said above, your weak 2s will have to get a bit off-shape, as well as your openers.

[Codo]

I totally agree with Richard.

Yes there is no hand to strong for 2 M and to weak for 1. But there are simple hands with a 6 card major which does not fit in 2 M or 1 M.

And if you are allowed to join the auction later, pd has a great picture from your hand, because he will ask himself why you did not open 2 Heart and he will find out.

And I believe that you will get many bad results from opening this hand in a 2/1 system. You simply cannot stop the train opposite say Kxx,x,Axxx,AQxxx and this is by no means a minimum for 2 Club over 1 Heart.

[Cascade]

Codo, on Jan 17 2008, 03:22 AM, said:

And I believe that you will get many bad results from opening this hand in a 2/1 system. You simply cannot stop the train opposite say Kxx,x,Axxx,AQxxx and this is by no means a minimum for 2 Club over 1 Heart.

I wouldn't want to force to game with less than that in a misfit hand.