[gwnn]

When is it right to play J from KJx... as third hand (first trick)? dummy has 2-3 small cards. my pd said something like "It's something very basic and automatic <- I get to know who has the queen".

[matmat]

is this at opening lead or midhand?

[jdonn]

after the opening lead in a suit contract you can do this if it's a situation where partner cannot have underled his ace and you will gain something by knowing where the Q is. Never do this in NT.

[pclayton]

Playing the J from KJx is a common discovery play, to see if declarer has the A or AQ (assuming pard didn't underlead the Ace). It can be used against a slam or other suit contracts.

Its mostly useful at suit contracts, but can be helpful at NT if you don't have any more entries and the suit looks like this:

---

Playing the Jack will allow us to cash 3 tricks in the suit, while the K followed by the J will lead to only 2.

[ArtK78]

jdonn, on Jan 14 2008, 03:57 PM, said:

after the opening lead in a suit contract you can do this if it's a situation where partner cannot have underled his ace and you will gain something by knowing where the Q is. Never do this in NT.

Never is a strong word. Perhaps it would be better to say don't do this in a notrump contract unless you have a very good reason for doing so.

There are times when you don't mind giving up the first round in the suit to declarer's queen even if partner has the ace.

[jdonn]

ArtK78, on Jan 14 2008, 03:59 PM, said:

jdonn, on Jan 14 2008, 03:57 PM, said:

after the opening lead in a suit contract you can do this if it's a situation where partner cannot have underled his ace and you will gain something by knowing where the Q is. Never do this in NT.

Never is a strong word. Perhaps it would be better to say don't do this in a notrump contract unless you have a very good reason for doing so.

There are times when you don't mind giving up the first round in the suit to declarer's queen even if partner has the ace.

No, there isn't when there is 2 small in dummy lol. Unless you like giving away tricks.

[jdonn]

pclayton, on Jan 14 2008, 03:57 PM, said:

Playing the J from KJx is a common discovery play, to see if declarer has the A or AQ (assuming pard didn't underlead the Ace). It can be used against a slam or other suit contracts.

Its mostly useful at suit contracts, but can be helpful if you don't have any more entries and the suit looks like this:

---

Playing the Jack will allow us to cash 3 tricks in the suit, while the K followed by the J will lead to only 2.

How would you ever know this is the layout? Play king and then small if you are worried about this. Don't play the jack.

[ArtK78]

Jlall, on Jan 14 2008, 04:04 PM, said:

Jdonn's first post pretty much sums it up. It is never right to play the jack there against notrump. Even if it was the layout pclayton presents, partner would never think you had the king later and he would misdefend.

Again that word "never." If that is the only lie of the cards that allows you to beat the contract and you are playing IMPs, then pard will play you for it.

This particular lie of the cards allows one to win the King and return small and still succeed if partner continues the suit.

[cherdano]

Removed.