[Fluffy]

♠AKJ
♥9752
♦QJ
♣J973

[Gerben42]

Playing a 15 - 17 NT this hand is between "Pass" and "Really pass" and is NOT an opening bid.

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

I would open it, but I am slowly
learning to pass this type of hands.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[hrothgar]

As always, the answer is completely dependent on system

If I am playing Regres this is a clear opening.
If I am playing Roth Stone, its a clear pass.

Personally, I'd pass this playing most systems. Given a choice between an 11+ - 14 HCP 1N opening and pass, I prefer pass.

[helene_t]

Clear pass, this is nowhere near a 12-count.

[FrancesHinden]

It's a mini NT.
Playing some form of limited (say, 9-14) opening system it's an opening.

But in any standard system it's a pass.

[Codo]

Cear pass in a normal strong NT system.
Clear mini NT.
Clear opening for HCP counters. But we aren´t counters, are we?
Maybe a weak NT (11-14), depending on the form of scoring and the opps. I think against our average field in a life mp tourney I had surely opened it nonvul.

[gwnn]

Are the openers really this shy? I see it's 10-8 in their favor!

I don't open all 12 counts so this is a very very clear pass. Would open it with a 12-14 or even 15 1NT though.

I suspect Harald would open it though, for example.

[bid_em_up]

My rule of thumb on a hand such as this is....that if you look at any hand and "have" to ask yourself:

"Is this an opening?"

then it isn't.

Some people will open these sort of hands in any position, I do not. Of course, its a 3rd/4th seat opening, the presumption is you are referring to 1st/2nd seats.

jmoo.

[mike777]

IF you open all balanced 11 hcp hands with one quick trick, then easy yes.

[jtfanclub]

Fluffy, on Dec 4 2007, 03:56 AM, said:

♠AKJ
♥9752
♦QJ
♣J973

Clear 1NT opening 1st or 2nd seat playing 12-15 NTs. I like the pre-emptive effect.

I'd be very tempted to pass this 3rd seat and hope for a throw-in.

SAYC...depends on my opponents. Against unknown opponents in a pairs game, I'd pass.

[ArtK78]

jtfanclub, on Dec 4 2007, 10:08 AM, said:

Fluffy, on Dec 4 2007, 03:56 AM, said:

♠AKJ
♥9752
♦QJ
♣J973

Clear 1NT opening 1st or 2nd seat playing 12-15 NTs. I like the pre-emptive effect.

I'd be very tempted to pass this 3rd seat and hope for a throw-in.

SAYC...depends on my opponents. Against unknown opponents in a pairs game, I'd pass.

You must be kidding. This is not a 12 count.

I would open a 10-12 NT on these cards, but I have not decided whether I would accept an invite to game.

I would not open this hand in any seat playing Standard. The only suit worth mentioning is spades, and I am not going to open 1♠ on a three card suit. [I played with a partner who did that once. I raised on 3 card support. We wound up doubling out the opponents in a heart partial. Each of the opponents assumed his partner was short in spades.]

[FrancesHinden]

bid_em_up, on Dec 4 2007, 03:42 PM, said:

Of course, its a 3rd/4th seat opening, the presumption is you are referring to 1st/2nd seats.

jmoo.

It's no more a 3rd seat opening than it is a 1st/2nd seat opening.

Opening light in third seat is (should be!) best done for lead directional reasons, (that's why many people switch to 4-card majors in 3rd seat, so you can open 1S on AKJx Kxx xxx Jxx). There's really no point at all in opening random balanced rubbish opposite a passed hand.

4th seat is a difficult problem. At IMPS I would still pass, as my expectation is negative. At club matchpoints I have painfully learnt never, ever to pass a hand out in 4th seat, I always get a bad result.

[Halo]

1NT (12-14) but not if partner has passed.

[pclayton]

Pass in ALL seats typically.

I might be persuaded to open a 12-14 NT in 1st at green, but thats about it.

[jtfanclub]

ArtK78, on Dec 4 2007, 10:13 AM, said:

You must be kidding. This is not a 12 count.

If partner has junk without a suit, we pre-empted the opponents. Good.
I partner has junk with a suit, I've got lots of support for any suit. Good.
If partner bids Stayman, I have a positive response. Good.
If partner bids game, I think my 12 count will be a 12 count. My queens and jacks will likely slot into his points, and you can't knock an AKJ.
If partner X's based on my points, I've got an AK combo with two chances for another defensive trick. That's all he should expect.

So what am I afraid of? My annual -1100? Comes once a year, and doesn't seem to depend on how strong my hand is.

3rd hand, the risks go up. I'll pass, or I should.

[jdonn]

mike777, on Dec 4 2007, 10:05 AM, said:

IF you open all balanced 11 hcp hands with one quick trick, then easy yes.

If you open all balanced 5+ counts with the five of hearts, then easy opening yes

[EricK]

FrancesHinden, on Dec 4 2007, 03:26 PM, said:

bid_em_up, on Dec 4 2007, 03:42 PM, said:

Of course, its a 3rd/4th seat opening, the presumption is you are referring to 1st/2nd seats.

jmoo.

It's no more a 3rd seat opening than it is a 1st/2nd seat opening.

Opening light in third seat is (should be!) best done for lead directional reasons, (that's why many people switch to 4-card majors in 3rd seat, so you can open 1S on AKJx Kxx xxx Jxx). There's really no point at all in opening random balanced rubbish opposite a passed hand..

I had presumed that the 3rd seat opening he had in mind was 1♠.

[Fluffy]

jtfanclub, on Dec 4 2007, 03:56 PM, said:

ArtK78, on Dec 4 2007, 10:13 AM, said:

You must be kidding.  This is not a 12 count.

If partner has junk without a suit, we pre-empted the opponents. Good.
I partner has junk with a suit, I've got lots of support for any suit. Good.
If partner bids Stayman, I have a positive response. Good.
If partner bids game, I think my 12 count will be a 12 count. My queens and jacks will likely slot into his points, and you can't knock an AKJ.
If partner X's based on my points, I've got an AK combo with two chances for another defensive trick. That's all he should expect.

So what am I afraid of? My annual -1100? Comes once a year, and doesn't seem to depend on how strong my hand is.

3rd hand, the risks go up. I'll pass, or I should.

Many options but you will need a lot more of work for mentioning what will happen if you open or not

[FrancesHinden]

jtfanclub, on Dec 4 2007, 04:56 PM, said:

If partner bids game, I think my 12 count will be a 12 count. My queens and jacks will likely slot into his points, and you can't knock an AKJ.
If partner X's based on my points, I've got an AK combo with two chances for another defensive trick. That's all he should expect.

This really is where the disagreement comes.

The passers think this hand does not have the playing/defensive strength that a 'normal' or 'standard' 12-count opening bid should promise.

I note the vote is very close, but I don't actually know if the bidders are voting to open because

- they believe this hand is worth a 12-count (as you state you do)
- or because they have a different standard for opening bids (as Mike777 seems to)