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Matchpoints All White Assign Blame

Poll: Blame (30 member(s) have cast votes)

Blame

  1. East (8 votes [26.67%])

    Percentage of vote: 26.67%

  2. West (10 votes [33.33%])

    Percentage of vote: 33.33%

  3. Neither (60% or less one way or the other) (2 votes [6.67%])

    Percentage of vote: 6.67%

  4. Nobody (I like 2 Hearts) (10 votes [33.33%])

    Percentage of vote: 33.33%

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#1 User is offline   jonottawa 

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Posted 2007-November-04, 17:34

Scoring: MP

P - 1♥ - P - 1N (forcing)
P - 2♦ P - 2♥
P - P - P


Not the most interesting hand this time. I told my pard in today's club game I'd post this here.

As far as agreements ... 2/1, 'normal' openers (not insanely aggressive or conservative.)
"Maybe we should all get together and buy Kaitlyn a box set of "All in the Family" for Chanukah. Archie didn't think he was a racist, the problem was with all the chinks, dagos, niggers, kikes, etc. ruining the country." ~ barmar
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#2 User is offline   mike777 

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Posted 2007-November-04, 19:01

Great post for the vast majority of us bridge players. Very common bidding issue.

East needs to rebid 2nt over 2H.

100% East at IMPs

here at MP....a bit less blame. :rolleyes:

btw I think this is a great bidding teaching hand for Int level or lower players.
Very common hand, very common bidding issue.
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#3 User is offline   han 

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Posted 2007-November-04, 19:42

Always a bit of a guess how to evaluate a hand with a stiff king. I think I would duplicate the auction.
Please note: I am interested in boring, bog standard, 2/1.

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#4 User is offline   pclayton 

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Posted 2007-November-04, 20:29

I think East might have opened 1N, but thats not everyone's taste. West could have rebid 2N or raised to 3♦, but 2♥ is OK.

The crux of the problem is East's pass of 2♥. Traditionally with a 16-17 count, you move over 2♥, in this case 2♠. Perhaps East was concerned that West is horsing around with a 4 count. Hands like this are an example of the pitfalls you face with ultra-light responses to one bids.

East gets 70% of the blame and West gets 30%. I am generous in giving points for bad luck or a systemic gap, but when you miss game with 26 combined points, something went wrong.
"Phil" on BBO
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#5 User is offline   ArtK78 

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Posted 2007-November-04, 20:30

I have no problem with the auction. 2♥ could easily have been the right spot.
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#6 User is offline   jdonn 

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Posted 2007-November-04, 20:33

I think west should rebid 2NT. No really strong feelings on either player's bidding.
Please let me know about any questions or interest or bug reports about GIB.
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#7 User is offline   Apollo81 

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Posted 2007-November-04, 21:40

I think both players took reasonable actions and reached a reasonable contract.
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#8 User is offline   Karma 

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Posted 2007-November-04, 21:54

Where was the option to blame both?

West is not minimum and should have bid 2NT. The scoring is MP and 2NT beats 2H. The bidding up to this point suggests 2NT is almost as likely to make as 2H, but might not make 3H. I will take the small risk for the extra reward. After 2N by West, East has an easy raise to 3N.

East has extra values and should bid 2NT over the 2H preference. For all the same reasons described above. After 2N by East, West should find a raise to 3N.

At IMP scoring it should get easier because players look for plus scores. Here is a good IMP auction for these hands:
1♥ 1N, 2♦ 3♦, 3♥ 3N
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#9 Guest_Jlall_*

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Posted 2007-November-04, 22:00

Totally standard auction at MP. Is this such a great game anyways?
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#10 User is offline   jonottawa 

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Posted 2007-November-04, 22:59

Thx for the feedback. I was West. Away from the table after the round pard said he thought I had a 2NT bid over 2♦. I was pretty sure that, while it's close for sure, I had made the consensus call at this form of scoring. So I told him I'd post it here.

He made 2 Hearts on the nose. I wasn't really paying attention (I seldom do when I'm dummy) so I'm not sure what the whole layout was. The matchpoints seem to indicate that game was touch and go, as expected.

430 7
400 5-
400 5-
110 3-
110 3-
-50 1-
-50 1-
-100 0

Since both players were uber-max for their bidding and game looks okay but not great, I really don't mind missing game here (if either player invites, his pard will accept even with a little bit less than what he held and then you'll be in a crappy game.) Usually the guy with 16 makes the move here, I think, but with stiff K (and godawful spots,) taking the low road seems eminently reasonable at matchpoints.
"Maybe we should all get together and buy Kaitlyn a box set of "All in the Family" for Chanukah. Archie didn't think he was a racist, the problem was with all the chinks, dagos, niggers, kikes, etc. ruining the country." ~ barmar
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#11 User is offline   skjaeran 

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Posted 2007-November-05, 16:00

I think this was a perfectly reasonable auction. IMO west isn't strong enough to rebid 2NT, but that's a style issue - I prefer a weak opening style and would never consider 2NT with the west hand.

East admittedly has 16 hcp and is thus close to bidding on. However there's no fillers in his hand and it's hard to evaluate the singleton ♣K. Bidding is possible, but I can't fault passing.
Kind regards,
Harald
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#12 User is offline   MickyB 

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Posted 2007-November-05, 18:11

Yup, reasonable auction. On a good day, oppo will protect with 2♠...it is love all at MPs after all.
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#13 User is offline   david_c 

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Posted 2007-November-05, 19:00

If this West hand is not a diamond raise, I want to change the system.
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#14 User is offline   MickyB 

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Posted 2007-November-05, 19:03

david_c, on Nov 6 2007, 02:00 AM, said:

If this West hand is not a diamond raise, I want to change the system.

I'd be tempted to bid 2♥ even if 2♦ promised four. +140 beats +130 :P

If this hand isn't a diamond raise, I want to change the system and the scoring!
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#15 User is offline   Echognome 

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Posted 2007-November-05, 19:14

The West hand is probably a good bidding problem in its own right. I can imagine any of 2♥, 2♠, 2NT, or 3♦ as options. Although I don't imagine that they would all get significant votes.
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#16 User is offline   pclayton 

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Posted 2007-November-05, 21:01

Seems everyone is rather sanguine about missing a game the field rates to be in.
"Phil" on BBO
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#17 User is offline   dicklont 

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Posted 2007-November-06, 00:26

2♥ shows a weak hand, West must find an invite. I think he can choose between 2NT and 3♦ and since the opposition did not bid spades i would bid 2NT.
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#18 User is offline   Codo 

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Posted 2007-November-06, 02:16

I think both are chickens.
I had bid 3 Diamond with Wests hand, not just 2 Heart.
And I had bid 2 NT after 2 Heart as east.
Kind Regards

Roland


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More system is not the answer...
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#19 User is offline   helene_t 

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Posted 2007-November-06, 02:44

pclayton, on Nov 6 2007, 05:01 AM, said:

Seems everyone is rather sanguine about missing a game the field rates to be in.

That's the field's problem.
The world would be such a happy place, if only everyone played Acol :) --- TramTicket
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#20 User is offline   pclayton 

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Posted 2007-November-06, 10:36

helene_t, on Nov 6 2007, 12:44 AM, said:

pclayton, on Nov 6 2007, 05:01 AM, said:

Seems everyone is rather sanguine about missing a game the field rates to be in.

That's the field's problem.

Helene - if you want to play tops and bottoms, go ahead.

Oddly enough with everyone content with the auction, perhaps 2♥ is the field contract :o
"Phil" on BBO
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