[jillybean]

Hand1

Dealer: East Vul: None Scoring: MP

♠ A842 ♥ AQ73 ♦ K943 ♣ J

West North East South

 -     -     Pass  1♦
 Pass  1♥    2♣    2♥
 Pass  3NT   Pass  ?  



Hand2

Scoring: MP

---

West North East South

 -     -     -     1♣
 Pass  1♥    Pass  2♥
 Pass  3NT   Pass  ?  


What (and why) are the best contracts for these 2 hands.

[Echognome]

When I have such a ruffing value, I can't imagine not playing in 4♥ on either hand. I know MP makes for a sick game, but I couldn't bring myself to passing 3NT. I suppose there is some layout where they make the same number of tricks, but I won't strain myself to imagine what those layouts are.

[Fluffy]

4333 often play better in NT than in 5-3 fit, but that isn't the same for a 4-4 fit, it is more complicated.

[cherdano]

I would usually not pass with 4 trumps, since I could have 3 of them. But I would definitely never ever pass with 4 trumps and a singleton.

[awm]

I would pass on the first hand. The reasoning is:

(1) Partner knows I have four hearts for the raise in competition, so having four hearts is not a reason to pull.

(2) Partner has advertised slow club values. We are probably getting a club lead, and my jack will help solidify his stopper (say he has ♣KTxx for example). Ruffing clubs may not be all that useful to us on this auction, and there is a strong possibility that LHO would overruff in any case.

On the second hand, the fourth heart and side singleton make it clear to pull to the major suit game. In this auction note that:

(1) I could have three hearts for the raise, and I have four.
(2) I have a small singleton, and no reason to think partner has slow values in that particular suit.

[Echognome]

Arend and Adam:

This is BIL, so why should we assume the raise could show only 3-card support? I'm not saying this is unreasonable, just saying it's an assumption, so should be stated as such.

For example "If my raise could show only 3 card support..."

[pclayton]

1. I bid 4♥ on the first. I know pard has good club stoppers, but our hand has shape and it isn't soft.

2. Also 4♥ on the 2nd. Unless pard has substantially extra values, 3N won't be a comfortable spot. Looking at the north hand, its a strange call anyway.

[jillybean]

Hand1

Scoring: IMP

---

West North East South

 -     -     Pass  1♦
 Pass  1♥    2♣    2♥
 Pass  3NT   Pass  Pass
 Pass  
Top

Hand2

Scoring: IMP

---

West North East South

 -     -     -     1♣
 Pass  1♥    Pass  2♥
 Pass  3NT   Pass  Pass
 Pass  

Bottom
I wasn't happy with the ♦x but after the previous boards result, I passed - trust your partner?

[jtfanclub]

jillybean2, on Oct 24 2007, 01:46 PM, said:

West North East South

 -     -     -     1♣
 Pass  1♥    Pass  2♥
 Pass  3NT   Pass  Pass
 Pass  [/font]

Bottom
I wasn't happy with the ♦x but after the previous boards result, I passed - trust your partner?

I don't think this has anything to do with trusting your partner....bidding a major then bidding 3NT just gives partner a choice of games. I don't know anybody who would think less of their partner for bidding 4♥ over 3NT on this auction...if they wanted to be in 3NT across 4 card support and shape, they'd just say 3NT.

[BillHiggin]

jillybean2, on Oct 24 2007, 01:46 PM, said:

I wasn't happy with the ♦x but after the previous boards result, I passed - trust your partner?

Yes, partner deserves your trust. Keep it alive by bidding 4♥ with 4 card support and a side singleton.

Partner has NOT unilaterally bid 3N as the FINAL contract. If partner had no interest in playing in the 4-4 fit, he would never have bothered to introduce the suit in the first place. Instead he is now offering a choice - "I have values for game, and am happy about the fit, but 3N might be better. What is your opinion". In both cases your singleton swing your opinion towards the major suit game. It matters not what the final result is - your hand is definitely better for suit play and since you were asked, you should base your action on what you can see.

Trust your partner! He asked a question - give the answer.

[bid_em_up]

JB,

Read what Bill just said again.

In the first case, the 3N bid is practically a demand to play there (the opponents have bid a suit). Ok, maybe not so much a demand, but it certainly says "I think 3N will be better than 4H." Partner has heard you raise hearts and heard the opponents bid clubs, so he has much more information to make a decision in this case. You are still allowed to correct to 4H though, and many would.

In the 2nd case, it is more, "I don't know which is better, you pick". Your hand should influence you to choose 4H.

I would pass 3N on the first and bid 4H on the second.

[jillybean]

Yep point taken, thanks. I didnt understand the difference after the first result.

[brianshark]

In both cases, 3NT is offering you a choice of places to play. I would definitely bid 4♥ on both boards. On board 1, despite the fact that partner is confident with his club stop, you might not have had 4 hearts, plus your prime controls (aces and kings) and singleton are good for suit contracts. On bd 2, despite this time your partner knowing you have 4 hearts, you have a small singleton in an unbid suit. I don't think I would even sit for 3N with a small doubleton.

[the hog]

I would bid 4H on both boards. Your partner's choice of 3NT on the second board is a very poor bid anyway. She has an 11 count 4 controls, good trumps and a poor D holding. Your pd should invite on this hand and you would accept with 4H.

Also you have 4 card H support in both cases which you don't have to have, BIL or not.

[helene_t]

Yes, 4♥. P bid hearts because he wanted to play in hearts if I have such a heart-oriented hand. He bid 3NT cattering for 3-card support and/or a flat hand with soft values. 3NT does not mean "forget my 1♥ bid, it was a mistake".

[han]

4H on both.