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Weak Jump Overcalls

Poll: At what colors would you overcall 3D? (60 member(s) have cast votes)

At what colors would you overcall 3D?

  1. Never (2 votes [3.33%])

    Percentage of vote: 3.33%

  2. Favorable only (6 votes [10.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 10.00%

  3. When not vulnerable (12 votes [20.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 20.00%

  4. Equal or favorable vulnerability (19 votes [31.67%])

    Percentage of vote: 31.67%

  5. Always (21 votes [35.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 35.00%

Vote Guests cannot vote

#1 User is offline   han 

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Posted 2007-September-11, 15:32

Suppose you play weak jump overcalls at all colors. RHO opens 1S, would you bid 3D with this hand:

Scoring: IMP

Please note: I am interested in boring, bog standard, 2/1.

- hrothgar
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#2 User is offline   gwnn 

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Posted 2007-September-11, 15:48

♥s and possibly ♠'s are breaking badly for them, let them guess, 3♦ always. The bad part about it is they may find a low hcp 3NT contract, cause I'm my hand is right from das Handbuch (in the sense that I have a good suit and no outside values, one ♦ less, yes, but that's life).
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#3 User is offline   pclayton 

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Posted 2007-September-11, 16:00

3♦ at adverse is a little silly. 3♦ at equal is agressive but reasonable, although we'd all rather do it w/w instead of r/r.
"Phil" on BBO
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#4 User is offline   Apollo81 

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Posted 2007-September-11, 16:15

I voted "when not vulnerable"
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#5 User is offline   david_c 

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Posted 2007-September-11, 16:52

The suit is good enough at any vulnerability. But I wouldn't bid 3♦ at unfavourable because it doesn't seem to achieve anything - at other vulnerabilities at least there is the possibility of finding a good sacrifice. You don't really expect this 3♦ to mess the opponents up very much, since they've already bid your shortest suit (most likely to be their fit), and if you manage to push them into a contract you don't have any defence.

So "equal or favourable" for me.
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#6 User is offline   Cascade 

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Posted 2007-September-11, 16:59

This hand might depend on the form of scoring as well.
Wayne Burrows

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#7 User is offline   jdonn 

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Posted 2007-September-11, 18:23

I would vote "when not vulnerable". This seems like the right combination of sane and aggressive to me. If I had no shortness I would only do it w/r. If I had a 7th diamond I would do it at any vul, unless 2272 in which case I would pass r/w. If 1471 I would bid 4♦ w/r.
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#8 User is offline   the hog 

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Posted 2007-September-11, 18:36

Yes at favourable or equal vulnerability.
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#9 User is offline   mike777 

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Posted 2007-September-11, 19:28

It seems to me that in front of an unpassed partner we should make the normal or standard bid unless given other facts.

No one has put forth what standard/normal is so here is one shot:
Unfav vul: have 2 less winners than level you bid.
Equal vul: have 3 less winners than level you bid.
fav vul: have 4 or 5 less winners than level you bid.

If you define standard as other, fair enough, but it would help to say what.
If you prefer random preempts fair enough but it would help to say why?
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#10 User is offline   Free 

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Posted 2007-September-12, 03:42

I find it too dangerous when Vulnerable. Whenever NV seems ok.
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#11 User is offline   whereagles 

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Posted 2007-September-12, 04:55

With an ODR of +6, I'm bidding all the time.
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#12 User is offline   Gerben42 

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Posted 2007-September-12, 05:39

If you pass at some vuln. maybe you shouldn't be playing WJO in that particular position.

I bid all except unfav.
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#13 User is offline   han 

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Posted 2007-September-12, 09:04

At the table I did bid 3D at both, but I thought that was pushing it.
Please note: I am interested in boring, bog standard, 2/1.

- hrothgar
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#14 Guest_Jlall_*

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Posted 2007-September-12, 09:26

red/white its def a pass, NV it's def a bid. red/red is close, I'd probably do it.
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#15 Guest_Jlall_*

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Posted 2007-September-12, 09:27

Gerben42, on Sep 12 2007, 06:39 AM, said:

If you pass at some vuln. maybe you shouldn't be playing WJO in that particular position.

Yeah totally agree, that's why I've given up on WJO when vul
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#16 User is online   awm 

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Posted 2007-September-12, 11:52

I'd bid at NV.

I don't think there's anything inconsistent with requiring a seven-card suit to make a WJO at the three-level at vulnerable. I think these bids have more to do with suit length/quality than overall values -- I wouldn't be happier bidding 3♦ on a six card suit at vulnerable if I had a few outside cards (qualifying for an IJO); in fact I'd probably be less happy...
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#17 User is offline   dake50 

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Posted 2007-September-16, 16:01

With 1 card spade, it's 87% they have 8+spade fit.
Opponents non-V, they must simply make the right decision/guess. Bid 3D.
Opps V, they must not miss 4S if making. 3D is wasted breath unless suggesting sac.
So NV vs V, 3D is senseless preempt. Give them a 'fielders' choice'? ?
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#18 User is offline   han 

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Posted 2007-September-16, 16:32

I see 17 people voted for for always, I must say I find 3D on a 6-card suit at unfavorable a bit sick. But the one person who voted for "never" isn't sick, that person is dead.
Please note: I am interested in boring, bog standard, 2/1.

- hrothgar
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#19 User is offline   kenrexford 

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Posted 2007-September-16, 20:26

Jlall, on Sep 12 2007, 10:27 AM, said:

Gerben42, on Sep 12 2007, 06:39 AM, said:

If you pass at some vuln. maybe you shouldn't be playing WJO in that particular position.

Yeah totally agree, that's why I've given up on WJO when vul

Anopther one for that philosophy here. 3♦ RvW for me is intermediate, and leaning toward strong.
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#20 User is offline   skjaeran 

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Posted 2007-September-18, 11:25

Hannie, on Sep 17 2007, 12:32 AM, said:

I see 17 people voted for for always, I must say I find 3D on a 6-card suit at unfavorable a bit sick. But the one person who voted for "never" isn't sick, that person is dead.

Really? I'm glad I'm neither in the 'sick' nor 'dead' camp then. :P
Kind regards,
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