[keylime]

I'd reluctantly pass here; I normally play a double here as honor showing in clubs for lead direction. It's somewhat rare to have a responsive double in this type of auction.

[Free]

Dbl, I don't want a ♣ lead...

[SoTired]

even if dbl was responsive (which I don't believe it is), i would not double with a 6-5.

I understand other's reluctance to bid, but after they have found their fit, we likely have a fit, also. I can't pass a 6-5.

I bid 3D.

[helene_t]

Dbl of Bergen raises may be t/o but this double shows clubs, for two reasons:
- It's not so important to be able to make t/o doubles when opps have, in principle, shown more than half the deck.
- Partner has shown clubs.

3♦ shows clubs too. It's a matter of frequency. Passed hands that have club length and/or a club honour are frequent. Passed hands that want to bid in spide of not having preempted are much less frequent. And those who play Muiderberg or Wilcox or some such don't have this problem at all.

Pass, too bad that I can't show this hand, but even if I could I'm not sure if it would make too much sense to do so.

I wonder if a double would make p lead his unsupported ♣A. In that case dbl would be fine.

[han]

Double shows clubs for me, so that's out. Imo double asking partner NOT to lead a club is imo crazy in an auction where you have not supported, imo.

I think it is a clear pass.

[Free]

Hannie, on Aug 13 2007, 08:54 AM, said:

Double shows clubs for me, so that's out. Imo double asking partner NOT to lead a club is imo crazy in an auction where you have not supported, imo.

I think it is a clear pass.

If partner can overcall to the 2-level, opponents won't make 3♣x, so Dbl is safe...

[cherdano]

Free, on Aug 13 2007, 02:47 AM, said:

Hannie, on Aug 13 2007, 08:54 AM, said:

Double shows clubs for me, so that's out. Imo double asking partner NOT to lead a club is imo crazy in an auction where you have not supported, imo.

If partner can overcall to the 2-level, opponents won't make 3♣x, so Dbl is safe...

That obviously wasn't Han's point - if you don't raise the suit, partner won't expect you to have anything in the suit, so using double to show you really don't have anything in the suit is waste of a very useful bid.

[Blofeld]

cherdano, on Aug 13 2007, 04:35 AM, said:

Free, on Aug 13 2007, 02:47 AM, said:

Hannie, on Aug 13 2007, 08:54 AM, said:

Double shows clubs for me, so that's out. Imo double asking partner NOT to lead a club is imo crazy in an auction where you have not supported, imo.

If partner can overcall to the 2-level, opponents won't make 3♣x, so Dbl is safe...

That obviously wasn't Han's point - if you don't raise the suit, partner won't expect you to have anything in the suit, so using double to show you really don't have anything in the suit is waste of a very useful bid.

I had the same reaction as Han and Arend, but on inspection I think Frederick must be saying that he inverts the meaning of pass and double here - is that right?

You'd give the opponents more room when you don't have a raise but less room when you do have one.

I think that the main problem would be memory, and working out when it does or doesn't apply. Double with that meaning may be safe here, but I don't think it would be if p made a 1M overcall and the cue was 2M.

[Free]

Yes, we reverse the meaning of Dbl and Pass, but only in situations where it's safe. When partner overcalls at the 2-level, this is considered safe.

The main argument of reversing these bids is the following:
- suppose you want partner to lead the suit. Opps won't have a full stopper, but they may have 2 half stoppers (Qx opposite Jxx for example). With pass you put pressure, while with Dbl you give away more space. When do you think they need the extra space the most?
- suppose you don't want partner to lead the suit. Opps will probably have a full stopper or even more, but they won't be strong enough to play a 3-level contract without a fit. If you give them space now, they can't use it anyway.

You can find more on my blog: http://freebridge.blogspot.com/2006/07/lea...ass-vs-dbl.html

[skjaeran]

Free, on Aug 13 2007, 01:32 PM, said:

Yes, we reverse the meaning of Dbl and Pass, but only in situations where it's safe. When partner overcalls at the 2-level, this is considered safe.

The main argument of reversing these bids is the following:
- suppose you want partner to lead the suit. Opps won't have a full stopper, but they may have 2 half stoppers (Qx opposite Jxx for example). With pass you put pressure, while with Dbl you give away more space. When do you think they need the extra space the most?
- suppose you don't want partner to lead the suit. Opps will probably have a full stopper or even more, but they won't be strong enough to play a 3-level contract without a fit. If you give them space now, they can't use it anyway.

You can find more on my blog: http://freebridge.blogspot.com/2006/07/lea...ass-vs-dbl.html

I've been doing the same in several partnerships over the years, for the same reasons.

[han]

I am familiar with the pass-double switch when they cuebid our suit. However, when we haven't raised yet it seems that we more often won't have something in the suit. So switching the meanings in this situation seems wrong, you will be doubling more often instead of less often.

Calling it crazy was a bit strong though, I guess it is playable and won't often matter. However, it seems just as easy to play that we inverse the meanings only when I (the doubler or passer) have bid or supported clubs. And better.

[jtfanclub]

Huh.

Auction is (1 Apple) 2 Grapes (3 Grapes) X

I guess I hadn't thought about what that auction should mean. I've always thought Grapes, but now that I think about it, it doesn't seem like that's really useful. If I have a fit, and I can't bid it, why show it?

It seems like there's several things that I'd like to say to partner, without risk. One use of the X could simply be 'strength'. You'll always get another call (to show or deny the fit), and the extra bidding room is less useful if the opposing hands have fewer points.

Maybe X should mean 'lead your suit'....not necessarily a fit, it could be an honor doubleton, for example.

I don't know. I take it standard expert practice is the same as Yellow Card in this case?

[han]

I think that most common is that the double of 3C is lead directing. However, if the auction is something like 1H- (1S) - 2H - (3H) - Dbl then it has become quite popular to play that the double asks partner NOT to lead hearts. Apparently the avant garde plays it over 3C too, with Frederick in the lead.