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Why do people feel the need to make an undiscussed bid in any case?
If you haven't discussed RKCB then simply blast the slam or stay in game or make an invitational bid and then agree something after the hand. The same goes for every convention.
Eric
online bridge different from live bridge? what makes it different?
#21
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Posted 2004-January-30, 01:57
#22
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Posted 2004-January-30, 10:11
If I am playing against a pick up partnership, and the bidding goes 4NT and some kind of reply, I will ask publically what the reply means. Something like, "does your 5♣ show 03 or 14 keycards". To get a public response. This is because a lot of f2f players will think it not fair to bid 5♣ and then say "03". But like uday says, this seems fairest.
Yesday, freee was playing against me with a pickup "expert" partner. I opened 1♠ and freee bid 2NT. His partner tanked, and I asked freee publically if his 2NT was "for the minors". While I was asking, his partner bid 3♥, free replied yes, his partner asked for an undo, and then bid 3♣. Freee then asked for a redeal (if only RHO hadn't bid 3♥ quite as fast). I mean come on, I think I beat all these guys when they know what their bids mean... I don't need to them to be all confused to win... hehehe
(tongue firmly planted in cheek for those who think the winning comment was serious).
ben
Yesday, freee was playing against me with a pickup "expert" partner. I opened 1♠ and freee bid 2NT. His partner tanked, and I asked freee publically if his 2NT was "for the minors". While I was asking, his partner bid 3♥, free replied yes, his partner asked for an undo, and then bid 3♣. Freee then asked for a redeal (if only RHO hadn't bid 3♥ quite as fast). I mean come on, I think I beat all these guys when they know what their bids mean... I don't need to them to be all confused to win... hehehe
(tongue firmly planted in cheek for those who think the winning comment was serious). ben
--Ben--
#23
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Posted 2004-January-31, 23:13
On the topic of alerts.. i agree with the sensible approach mentioned by a few.. y shouldnt alert something y dont have an agreement about, but answer q if asked obviously. ..but dont feel strongly about this ..will go with the flow..
As regards on-line bridge in general.. it's a great bonus for those of us in countries (like N.Ireland) where the general standard is low and the few strong players only play in teams, trials and a few major tournaments. In addition to that i get the chance to play against systems not commonly played here (even 2/1 is 'unusual'!)
Finally.. i get a chance to keep in touch with 'old' friends/opps from my few spells overseas (like 'The Hog'!) .. all this I regard as a great bonus.
Regards, Dogsbreath
As regards on-line bridge in general.. it's a great bonus for those of us in countries (like N.Ireland) where the general standard is low and the few strong players only play in teams, trials and a few major tournaments. In addition to that i get the chance to play against systems not commonly played here (even 2/1 is 'unusual'!)
Finally.. i get a chance to keep in touch with 'old' friends/opps from my few spells overseas (like 'The Hog'!) .. all this I regard as a great bonus.
Regards, Dogsbreath
ManoVerboard
#24
- mmm Duvel
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Posted 2004-February-01, 10:11
inquiry, on Jan 31 2004, 01:11 AM, said:
Yesday, freee was playing against me with a pickup "expert" partner. I opened 1♠ and freee bid 2NT. His partner tanked, and I asked freee publically if his 2NT was "for the minors". While I was asking, his partner bid 3♥, free replied yes, his partner asked for an undo, and then bid 3♣. Freee then asked for a redeal (if only RHO hadn't bid 3♥ quite as fast). I mean come on, I think I beat all these guys when they know what their bids mean... I don't need to them to be all confused to win... hehehe (tongue firmly planted in cheek for those who think the winning comment was serious).
ben
(tongue firmly planted in cheek for those who think the winning comment was serious). ben
Yeah, this guy claimed he was an expert, but the only thing he could was discovering my psyche!!! All other stuff (bidding AND play) were awful! These so called experts should be unable to put "expert" or "world class" in their profiles!! All by all I still had fun, private messenging Ben
"It may be rude to leave to go to the bathroom, but it's downright stupid to sit there and piss yourself" - blackshoe
#25
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Posted 2004-February-01, 23:00
2/1 being unusual, wow, it is a diverse world we live in...and to think I might try four card majors one day. 
"Champions aren't made in gyms, champions are made from something they have deep inside them - a desire, a dream, a vision. They have to have last-minute stamina, they have to be a little faster, they have to have the skill and the will. But the will must be stronger than the skill. " - M. Ali
#26
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Posted 2004-February-02, 03:31
Hi friends!
I think BBO self alerting is better than f2f screens alerting procedure, thanks to Fred and Uday. Lack of possibility to type alerting text before the bid is a bug and I hope Uday will clear it soon
.
The big problem in my opinion with self alerting is most of players can't understand, that same alert is not to show what alerter holds in hand, but what same bid means by partnership agreements. If you have expert partner like Ben, things are even more complicate, because he can count deal, despite meaning of your bid by your agreements and can make unusual decision. May be directors need to add explanation about self arerting at the begining of tourney?
Another big problem with most of directors they can't switch from "player mode" to "director mode". The director can't be witness, even when he was at table!!! The director can make decisions, only when he was called at table by players, when opps are at table too and must receive explanations before to make a decision!!!. Making judments later, without presence of both contestants is simple unfair... Topfight similar director's mistakes made me 2 insteasd of 1 at topfight event
.
Misho
I think BBO self alerting is better than f2f screens alerting procedure, thanks to Fred and Uday. Lack of possibility to type alerting text before the bid is a bug and I hope Uday will clear it soon
. The big problem in my opinion with self alerting is most of players can't understand, that same alert is not to show what alerter holds in hand, but what same bid means by partnership agreements. If you have expert partner like Ben, things are even more complicate, because he can count deal, despite meaning of your bid by your agreements and can make unusual decision. May be directors need to add explanation about self arerting at the begining of tourney?
Another big problem with most of directors they can't switch from "player mode" to "director mode". The director can't be witness, even when he was at table!!! The director can make decisions, only when he was called at table by players, when opps are at table too and must receive explanations before to make a decision!!!. Making judments later, without presence of both contestants is simple unfair... Topfight similar director's mistakes made me 2 insteasd of 1 at topfight event
.Misho
MishoVnBg
#27
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Posted 2004-February-02, 08:52
Making judments later, without presence of both contestants is simple unfair... Topfight similar director's mistakes made me 2 insteasd of 1 at topfight event
I happened to be kibitzing when the hand in question occurred. It is an interesting case study for directors, perhaps, and shows what is happening. On an earlier hand, the player who eventually called director, asked where the heart QUEEN was, and found it off side claimed down one. Turns out, the heart finessee need not be taken, because dummy had a good ♦ that allows the heart loser to be thrown away. This blind spot would have cost the declarer the contract and assured misho and his partner first place. But, not wanting to take advantage of a mental lapse perhaps, misho and his partner rejected the down one claim and asked about the good ♦. Declearer quickly claimed making. This turned a TOP (100%) matchpoint score into a bottom (0%). Perhaps this is a bit very high active ethics (after all, you are not suppose to save opponents from their only silly mental lapses). Fast forward two hands. The bidding goes...
1NT(11-15)- DBL - RDBL(*alert) - 2♠
Pass - 4♠ - DBL - ALL PASS
Four ♠ was the contract at 2/3 rds of the tables, only doubled at this one. The defense against 4♠ was brutal and precise, down three, the most down at any table. This would have been a top (100%) for Misho and his partner. Yet in the middle of the next round, the score was changed from the top to an AVERAGE by the director. The reason, is that the "redouble" was slow being explained. RDBL was transfer to club, but of course, it is possible the redouble might have been left in despite this (1NTx-XX) makes overtricks. North had six spades and no desire to play 1NTx-XX. If North had passed, it is not clear the biddign would have stopped short of 4♠ anyway, as south would have bid 2♥ and north would have pulled to 2♠, and south is likely to have jumped to 4♠ or bid 3♠, both would have been doubled for same top.
Finally, in a expert game, the REDOUBLE over 1NT-x in itself (but especially when highlighted as an alert) is self-alerting. This is not to suggest that correcting the result in itself was "wrong", but Misho's explaination suggest the result was corrected without consultation with him (his partner made the redouble, and I don't know if the director asked his partner about the timing of the alert and the explaination of the bid). But I think Misho's point should be heeded by the directors. Before changing a score based upon alleged mis-information, etc, you should hear from both sides. After all, it is only fair to hear from both sides. In this case, it is clear from the earlier hand that Misho and his partner practice very high ethics, and if they thought the correction wasn't justified on the second board, I suspect the director at least owed them a hearing on the subject.
Ben
I happened to be kibitzing when the hand in question occurred. It is an interesting case study for directors, perhaps, and shows what is happening. On an earlier hand, the player who eventually called director, asked where the heart QUEEN was, and found it off side claimed down one. Turns out, the heart finessee need not be taken, because dummy had a good ♦ that allows the heart loser to be thrown away. This blind spot would have cost the declarer the contract and assured misho and his partner first place. But, not wanting to take advantage of a mental lapse perhaps, misho and his partner rejected the down one claim and asked about the good ♦. Declearer quickly claimed making. This turned a TOP (100%) matchpoint score into a bottom (0%). Perhaps this is a bit very high active ethics (after all, you are not suppose to save opponents from their only silly mental lapses). Fast forward two hands. The bidding goes...
1NT(11-15)- DBL - RDBL(*alert) - 2♠
Pass - 4♠ - DBL - ALL PASS
Four ♠ was the contract at 2/3 rds of the tables, only doubled at this one. The defense against 4♠ was brutal and precise, down three, the most down at any table. This would have been a top (100%) for Misho and his partner. Yet in the middle of the next round, the score was changed from the top to an AVERAGE by the director. The reason, is that the "redouble" was slow being explained. RDBL was transfer to club, but of course, it is possible the redouble might have been left in despite this (1NTx-XX) makes overtricks. North had six spades and no desire to play 1NTx-XX. If North had passed, it is not clear the biddign would have stopped short of 4♠ anyway, as south would have bid 2♥ and north would have pulled to 2♠, and south is likely to have jumped to 4♠ or bid 3♠, both would have been doubled for same top.
Finally, in a expert game, the REDOUBLE over 1NT-x in itself (but especially when highlighted as an alert) is self-alerting. This is not to suggest that correcting the result in itself was "wrong", but Misho's explaination suggest the result was corrected without consultation with him (his partner made the redouble, and I don't know if the director asked his partner about the timing of the alert and the explaination of the bid). But I think Misho's point should be heeded by the directors. Before changing a score based upon alleged mis-information, etc, you should hear from both sides. After all, it is only fair to hear from both sides. In this case, it is clear from the earlier hand that Misho and his partner practice very high ethics, and if they thought the correction wasn't justified on the second board, I suspect the director at least owed them a hearing on the subject.
Ben
--Ben--