[sceptic]

Scoring: IMP

---

West North East South

 -     Pass  1♥    1♠
 Pass  2♥    Pass  3♦
 3♥    4♠    Pass  Pass
 Pass  

[jillybean]

!! find a new partner

edit: ignore this, I misread the auction

[sceptic]

hehe why I did not think he bid badly, it is my 3D I am curious about

[ralph23]

♣♦♥♠

2♥ by North is ok for me. I am thinking both the ♥Q and ♣J will be useless so it's a bit agressive with a balanced hand with only 3♥, but I think it is OK.

3♦ is fine and your King of ♥ is well placed. I don't see a thing wrong with it.

4♠ is aggressive by North (again) with the "wasted" round suit values, but how can he be blamed after hearing 3♦ from South?

[badderzboy]

All about agreements but an unassuming cue bid asks how good the overcall was and the 3♦ bid shows a good overcall now ptr sees a double fit with a near max overcall and feels the temptation so would I.

Now the question is 2♠s or 3♦s and given all my kings sit pretty I don't mind 3♦s

Steve

[jtfanclub]

Looks like the usual IMP overbidding to me.

I like 2♥ as North. A bit pushy, but it's IMPs.

I would not bid 3♦ as South. It's aceless, it's balanced, and it's an 11 count. Looks a queen or a singleton shy of forcing to game to me. I do play that 3♦ here is a GF.

[ralph23]

jtfanclub, on Jul 20 2007, 04:08 PM, said:

I do play that 3♦ here is a GF.

My p & I would play it as help-suit game try, so I still think 3♦ is fine. I do agree that South doesn't have enough to insist on game.

[jtfanclub]

ralph23, on Jul 20 2007, 04:17 PM, said:

My p & I would play it as help-suit game try, so I still think 3♦ is fine. I do agree that South doesn't have enough to insist on game.

Hmmm...so what's BWS? Is this call a GF or HSGT?

[sceptic]

so is 3D GF or shape showing and inv or help suit GT? this is what I want to understand

[ralph23]

jtfanclub, on Jul 20 2007, 04:21 PM, said:

ralph23, on Jul 20 2007, 04:17 PM, said:

My p & I would play it as help-suit game try, so I still think 3♦ is fine. I do agree that South doesn't have enough to insist on game.

Hmmm...so what's BWS? Is this call a GF or HSGT?

♣♦♥♠

The standard doesn't go that far ... it doesn't discuss overcaller's actions after advancer makes a cue bid raise.

http://www.bridgeworld.com/default.asp?d=b...bwsall.html#VIC

If 3♦ is GF, what would 4♦ be in your methods ?

[TimG]

I think 2♥ and 3♦ were both pushy.

[jtfanclub]

ralph23, on Jul 20 2007, 04:30 PM, said:

If 3♦ is GF, what would 4♦ be in your methods ?

Bleah, define the bid, don't define the responses...that seems very BWSish.

4♦ would be Splinter with a self-supporting (original) suit. I don't play the cue bid promises support...it could also be a hand with full opening count with a suit of its own (since a new suit would be NF constructive, you need to cue to do forcing constructive). For that reason, I don't think I've ever had a hand that bid 4♦.

[cherdano]

3♦ is an overbid.
Btw, I would assume 2H promises a fit here no matter what your agreements are, as advancer is a passed hanhd.

[skjaeran]

I disagree with those saying 2♥ was pushy. I think that was an obvious bid.
IMO 3♦ was an overbid, but not by much. I'd rebid 2♠.

[jtfanclub]

cherdano, on Jul 20 2007, 05:10 PM, said:

3♦ is an overbid.
Btw, I would assume 2H promises a fit here no matter what your agreements are, as advancer is a passed hanhd.

Good point, missed that, sorry.

[mikeh]

2♥ is fine: indeed, no other call makes any sense. Passed hands don't generally hold more than 11 hcp, and the ♥ Q is not always wasted: give partner AJ or A10x or K10x etc.

3♦ was an overbid opposite a passed hand. Aces... where are the Aces I will need for game?

So I would have bid 2♠....yes, it is a maximum for 2♠, but when we start upgrading ALL maximums, they are no longer maximums, they are minimums for the stronger bid.. and this is still just a maximum 2♠.

BTW, I fully understand that changing the ♥K to the ♥A might cause me to bid 3♦ and get the same terrible result... I try to post the thoughts I would have at the table, not the thoughts that get me to the right result in the forum

[jtfanclub]

mikeh, on Jul 20 2007, 05:25 PM, said:

BTW, I fully understand that changing the ♥K to the ♥A might cause me to bid 3♦ and get the same terrible result... I try to post the thoughts I would have at the table, not the thoughts that get me to the right result in the forum

Luckily the same shift in time that moves the heart ace to your hand moves the heart King to your LHO, so when he leads his partner's suit you actually make it.

So what's your opinion on the real question (IMHO)...3♦ in this auction, GF or HSGT? When you play it, and in Bridge World Standard?

[zasanya]

North has already shown 10-11 points with implied ♠ fit.On opponents bidding he should infer that ♥ Q is likely to be wasted.He has 3trumps anot 4 so he should bid 3♠ and not 4 despite the ♦ fit.

[mike777]

sceptic, on Jul 20 2007, 03:44 PM, said:

Scoring: IMP

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West North East South

 -     Pass  1♥    1♠
 Pass  2♥    Pass  3♦
 3♥    4♠    Pass  Pass
 Pass  

2h by passed hand is 100% limit raise by passed hand.
I rebid 2s, decline invite.