[Trpltrbl]

Is anybody interested in Minorsuitasking after 1NT- 2 CL- 2 D ? You will be losing out on garbage stayman but I find it a really neat and very handy convention. Will get y to very good spots, especially slams and 5 of a minor suit contracts. ;D

[Trpltrbl]

It is fairly simple, but can work great. I will put it up.
1 NT- 2Cl
2 D - 2 SP= Balanced GF hand

2 NT 3-3-4-3 or 3-3-3-4
3 CL 5+ Clubs
3 D 5+ Diamonds
3 H 3-2-4-4
3 SP 2-3-4-4
3 NT 2-2-4-5 or 2-2-5-4

Let me know if y like it, or if y have some ideas ;D

[lenze]

In case you are interested, this is what i have played for over 20 years

After 1 NT Opening

2C = Stayman or slam try in Diamonds
Opener bids:
·  2D = Denies 4 Hearts. May have four Spades
·  2H = 4+ Hearts. Denies 4 Spades
·  2S = Both majors
·  2NT = No major, 2 Diamonds and 5 + Clubs(minimum)
·  3C = No major, 2 Diamonds and 5 + Clubs (maximum)
Responder’s re-bids:
·  After 2 D(Denies 4 Hearts)
·  2 H asks for 4 card Spade suit
·  2 S = 4+Spades
·  After 2S , 3 of a minor suit = 4+ and also 4 Spades(slam try), 3 Hearts = slam try in Spades with undisclosed singleton. (Opener bids 3 NT to ask), 3 S is invitational to game, 4 C = RCK in Spades
·  2 NT=Minimum w/o Spades
·  After 2NT, 3 minor is natural 4+ (slam interest)
·  3C=maximum with 5+Clubs
·  3D=maximum with 5+Diamonds
·  3H=maximum with both minors
·  3S=maximum with Spades (probably 5)
·  3NT=maximum and 3-3-3-4 or 3-3-4-3
·  2 S = slam interest in Diamonds
·  Opener bids
·  2NT = Strong interest in Diamond slam(Hxxx or better)
·  3C = Hxx or xxxx in Diamonds
·  3D = Hx or xxx in Diamonds
·  3H= maximum with both minors
·  3S = 5 card suit and no Diamond interest (xx)
·  3NT = Balanced hand, no interest (xx)
·  2 NT = invitation to 3 NT
·  3 C = 4+ Clubs with 4 Hearts (slam interest)
·  3 D = 4 + Diamonds with 4 Hearts ( slam interest)
·  3 H = 4 Hearts and 5 Spades (Smolen)
·  3 S = 4 Spades and 5 Hearts (Smolen)
·  3 NT = to play
·  After 2 H( 4+ Hearts, denies 4 Spades)
·  2 S = slam interest in Diamonds
·  Opener bids
·  2NT = Strong interest in Diamond slam(Hxxx or better)
·  3C = Hxx or xxxx in Diamonds
·  3D = Hx or xxx in Diamonds
·  3H= 5 card suit and no Diamond interest (xx)
·  3S = maximum with both minors
·  3NT = Balanced hand, no interest (xx)
·  2 NT = invitational to 3 NT
·  3 C = 4+ Clubs and 4 Spades
·  3 D = 4 + Diamonds and 4 Spades
·  3 H = invitational raise
·  3 S = 4 Hearts and an undisclosed singleton with slam interest (Opener bids 3 NT to ask for singleton.)
·  3 NT = to play
·  4 C = RKC for Hearts


·  After 2 S (Both majors)
·  2 NT = invitational to 3 NT( no major)
·  3 C = slam try in Diamonds (usually 6+ Diamonds)
·  3 D = relay to 3 Hearts ( 4 C is then RKC Hearts)
·  3 H = relay to 3 Spades ( 4 C is then RKC Spades)
·  3 NT = to play (probably a 5 card Diamond suit)


·  After 2 NT( No major, only 2 Diamonds, 5+Clubs and minimum)
·  3 C = slam try in Clubs
·  3 D = slam interest in Diamonds
·  3 H = 4 Hearts and 5 Spades (Smolen)
·  3 S = 4 Spades and 5 Hearts (Smolen)
·  3 NT = to play

·  After 3 C(No major, only 2 Diamonds, 5+ Clubs and maximum)
·  3 D = slam try in Diamonds
·  3 H = 4 Hearts and 5 Spades (Smolen)
·  3 S = 4 Spades and 5 Hearts (Smolen)
·  3 NT = to play
·  4 C = slam try in Clubs

After 1 NT Opening
·  2 D = transfer to Hearts, or slam try in Clubs
·  Opener always accepts the transfer with 2 Hs
·  After the 2 H bid, responder bids
·  2 S = forget Hearts, slam try in Clubs
·  Opener rebids
·  2 NT = Good Club support(Hxxx or better)
·  3 C = Fair Club support (Hxx or xxxx)
·  3 D = Hx or xxx in Clubs
·  3 H = 5 card suit, no Club interest (xx)  
·  3 S = 5 card suit, no Club interest (xx)
·  3 NT = Balanced hand, no slam interest (xx)
·  2 NT = 5 Hearts, invitational to game
·  3 C = 5 Hearts and 4+ Clubs (mild slam interest)
·  3 D = 5 Hearts and 4+ Diamonds( mild slam interest)
·  3 H = 6+ Hearts and invites game
·  3 S = 6+ Hearts and an undisclosed singleton/void(3NT by opener asks)
·  3 NT = to play
·  4 C = RKC in Hearts

NOTE: Any bid but 2 Spades promises 5+ Hearts

Other Bids after 1 NT Openings
·  2 H = Transfer to Spades
·  2 S = Minor suit stayman (or Diamond bust)
·  2 NT = Relay to 3 Clubs ( Club bust or 4441 hand)
·  3 Minor invites 3 NT
·  3 Major = Splinter with 3 cards in other major
·  4 C = Straight Gerber
·  4 D & 4 H = Texas transfer

[Trpltrbl]

;D Wow that sure is long but looks very nice. Does it work very well in the real bridge World ? Or do mistakes happens because it is so long ? And people forget? Unless y play that with same pd for long time, but is ure looks good I already printed it out. Thx for r response 8)

[hrothgar]

At some point in time it gets becomes more practical to adopt a full blown relay structure over 1NT openings. Here is a fairly simply structure that utilitzed transfer based principles and is fairly symmetric in nature.

WHile the structure looks complex, there is actually a very simple pattern underlying the entire structure.
The NT opener can only have one of three possible shapes (4432, 5332, 4333)

After a 1NT opening, 2C = relay and then

2D = 4+ Hearts
2H = Relay
2S = 4432 with Hearts and Spades
2N = relay
3C = 4423 shape
3D = 4432 shape
2N = 5332 with 5 Hearts
3C = Relay
3D = 2533 shape
3H = 3523 shape
3S = 3532 shape
3C = 4432 with Hearts and Diamonds
3D = Relay
3H = 4243 shape
3S = 4342 shape
3D = 2434 shape
3H = 3424 shape
2H = 4+ Spades
2S = Relay
2N = 5332 with 5 spades
3C = Relay
3D = 5233 shape
3H = 5323 shape
3S = 5332 shape
3C = 4432 with Spades and Diamonds
3D = Relay
3H = 4243 shape
3S = 4342 shape
3D = 4234 shape
3H = 4324 shape
2S = Any 4333
2N = Relay
3C = 4333 shape
3D = 3433 shape
3H = 3343 shape
3S = 3334 shape
2N = 5332 shape with 5 Diamonds
3C = Relay
3D = 2353 shape
3H = 3252 shape
3S = 3352 shape
3C = 4432 with Clubs and Diamonds
3D = Relay
3H = 2344 shape
3S = 3244 shape
3D = 2335 shape
3H = 3235 shape
3S = 3325 shape

[Trpltrbl]

THX, that sure seems like a fairly simple but good system. And y r rite, there is a structure to it. Will have a deeper look at it.

Thx Mike ;D

[Free]

I play some sort of extended stayman where I can ask the entire shape of opener. I still have garbage stayman, but can't show preference for spades. This is how I bid after 1NT-2C-2D-?:

2H = garbage stayman
2S = relay, asks more information
2NT = 5 card C or 3334
3C = relay
3D = 3334 distribution
3H = relay
3S = 3-3-3-4
3NT = 3-3-4-3
3H = 3-3-2-5
3S = 3-2-3-5
3NT = 2-3-3-5
3C = 5 card D
3D = relay
3H = 3-3-5-2
3S = 3-2-5-3
3NT = 2-3-5-3
3D = 4-4 minor
3H = relay
3S = 3-2-4-4
3NT = 2-3-4-4
3H = 6 card minor
3S = agree to play in the minor, trf it
3NT = 6 card C
4C = RKC C
4C = 6 card D
4D = RKC D
3S = 5C-4D
3NT = 5D-4C
3M = Smolen

I think this way is better than yours Trpltrbl, but it's also more complicated. I haven't had any problems with it, it still contains weak stayman and can ask the entire shape (including 6 card or 5-4 minor, but that's rare). It's part of an entire relay structure: after 2H response of opener - shows 4+H - 2S is also relay to ask shape and after 2S responce - shows exactly 4S - 3C is also such a relay.

Free

[Trpltrbl]

Quote

I play some sort of extended stayman where I can ask the entire shape of opener. I still have garbage stayman, but can't show preference for spades. This is how I bid after 1NT-2C-2D-?:

2H = garbage stayman
2S = relay, asks more information
2NT = 5 card C or 3334
3C = relay
3D = 3334 distribution
3H = relay
3S = 3-3-3-4
3NT = 3-3-4-3
3H = 3-3-2-5
3S = 3-2-3-5
3NT = 2-3-3-5
3C = 5 card D
3D = relay
3H = 3-3-5-2
3S = 3-2-5-3
3NT = 2-3-5-3
3D = 4-4 minor
3H = relay
3S = 3-2-4-4
3NT = 2-3-4-4
3H = 6 card minor
3S = agree to play in the minor, trf it
3NT = 6 card C
4C = RKC C
4C = 6 card D
4D = RKC D
3S = 5C-4D
3NT = 5D-4C
3M = Smolen

I think this way is better than yours Trpltrbl, but it's also more complicated. I haven't had any problems with it, it still contains weak stayman and can ask the entire shape (including 6 card or 5-4 minor, but that's rare). It's part of an entire relay structure: after 2H response of opener - shows 4+H - 2S is also relay to ask shape and after 2S responce - shows exactly 4S - 3C is also such a relay.

Free

It does look better but definately more complicated, I like to keep it simple. Less to forget. I mean if I find the rite pd willing to put same in Bridge as me I will probably go to system like Meckwell or Keylime but for rite now I just make my pd's happy with simple systems

Mike ;D

[flytoox]

Trpltrbl, on Dec 19 2003, 08:36 PM, said:

It is fairly simple, but can work great. I will put it up.
1 NT- 2Cl
2 D - 2 SP= Balanced GF hand

Let me know if y like it, or if y have some ideas ;D

Mike, how to handle 5s4h invitational hand? if 2c-2d-2s show balanced gf hand? perhaps better to list ur whole nt structure b4 i evaluate this:)
fly

[Trpltrbl]

flytoox, on Jan 12 2004, 05:18 PM, said:

Trpltrbl, on Dec 19 2003, 08:36 PM, said:

It is fairly simple, but can work great. I will put it up.
1 NT- 2Cl
2 D  - 2 SP= Balanced GF hand

Let me know if y like it, or if y have some ideas  ;D

Mike, how to handle 5s4h invitational hand? if 2c-2d-2s show balanced gf hand? perhaps better to list ur whole nt structure b4 i evaluate this:)
fly

I use Smolen for 5-4 hands in majors. And I don't open 1 NT with 5-4 in majors.
I use my 3 level responses to 1 NT as follows
3= Puppetstayman
3= 5-5 in Minors Invitational
3= 5-5 in Majors Invitational
3= 5-5 in Majors Slamforcing, even though I have been playing with this to be a Transfer to 3 NT to show a singlesuited slamtry in a specific minor.
Which will leave my regular Transfer to minors for only weak or invitational hands.
And all this is based on opening a 15-17 NT.
I also play 10-12 NT NV and 12-14 nt VUL.
I still play Smolen, Stayman, 4 suit Transfers and my 3 level responses are all GF and either 4-4-4-1 with the suit you bid being the singleton or 1-3-5-4 with the suit being bid showing singleton in Major and 5-4 in minors. As you can tell this is mostly set up for IMP's were the occasional extra 30 or 60 not going to cost you the match

Mike

[flytoox]

Trpltrbl, on Jan 13 2004, 12:00 AM, said:

flytoox, on Jan 12 2004, 05:18 PM, said:

Trpltrbl, on Dec 19 2003, 08:36 PM, said:

It is fairly simple, but can work great. I will put it up.
1 NT- 2Cl
2 D  - 2 SP= Balanced GF hand

Let me know if y like it, or if y have some ideas  ;D

Mike, how to handle 5s4h invitational hand? if 2c-2d-2s show balanced gf hand? perhaps better to list ur whole nt structure b4 i evaluate this:)
fly

I use Smolen for 5-4 hands in majors. And I don't open 1 NT with 5-4 in majors.
I use my 3 level responses to 1 NT as follows
3= Puppetstayman
3= 5-5 in Minors Invitational
3= 5-5 in Majors Invitational
3= 5-5 in Majors Slamforcing, even though I have been playing with this to be a Transfer to 3 NT to show a singlesuited slamtry in a specific minor.
Which will leave my regular Transfer to minors for only weak or invitational hands.
And all this is based on opening a 15-17 NT.
I also play 10-12 NT NV and 12-14 nt VUL.
I still play Smolen, Stayman, 4 suit Transfers and my 3 level responses are all GF and either 4-4-4-1 with the suit you bid being the singleton or 1-3-5-4 with the suit being bid showing singleton in Major and 5-4 in minors. As you can tell this is mostly set up for IMP's were the occasional extra 30 or 60 not going to cost you the match

Mike

Perhaps I didnt make it clear. I understand you play smolen for game force with 54 major. I mean how responder hanlde 5s4h with invitational strength. For example, with
S: KJXXX
H: AJXX
D: XX
C: XX
PD OPEN 1N, how to show this hand to pd?

fly

[Free]

1NT - 2H
2S - 3H
...

Btw, this isn't an invitational hand imo.

[Trpltrbl]

Free, on Jan 15 2004, 06:50 PM, said:

1NT - 2H
2S - 3H
...

Btw, this isn't an invitational hand imo.

I agree, didn't see the problem since with smolen and my 5-5 responses this bidding shows 5-4, but I do play it as GF, but am giving pd a change to go to 3 NT or 3 or possibly game in major.

Mike