[kenberg]

My understanding of snapdragon doubles is that after (1C)-1D-(1S), a double by the partner of the overcaller would show a heart suit worth bidding and a tolerance for diamonds, while a 2H bid, instead of a double, would show hearts with no interest in diamonds.


I was watching a lesson: (1C)-1D-(2S)-X. Is it clear to you whether the X is for penalty or take-out, and if it is for take-out is the snapdragon interpretation still in force or is it just some general show of strength?

The 2S was a weak jump shift.

[Echognome]

My understanding of snapdragon is that it is typically played through 2♠, but no higher. I believe it was Jeremy Flint that invented it and occurs whenever the auction has had three different suits mentioned in a row. I've also heard it called the Impossible double. Depending on the level to which you are forcing the auction, I've heard of some playing it as showing 5-3 shape (that is 3 card support) or if overcaller can play at the two-level, some will snapdragon with Hx support. I've always played it as 5-3 minimum and try to fit jump with 5-4 shape. Regardless, it's a good area for you to have a discussion with your regular partners.

[BudH]

Echognome, on May 2 2007, 02:47 PM, said:

My understanding of snapdragon is that it is typically played through 2♠, but no higher.  I believe it was Jeremy Flint that invented it and occurs whenever the auction has had three different suits mentioned in a row.  I've also heard it called the Impossible double.  Depending on the level to which you are forcing the auction, I've heard of some playing it as showing 5-3 shape (that is 3 card support) or if overcaller can play at the two-level, some will snapdragon with Hx support.  I've always played it as 5-3 minimum and try to fit jump with 5-4 shape.  Regardless, it's a good area for you to have a discussion with your regular partners.

Double of the preemptive 2♠ should NOT be Snapdragon for two reasons:

1. 2♠ is a non-forcing bid.
2. It is beyond a single raise of partner's overcalled suit.


Bud H

[gwnn]

If it shouldn't be snapdragon, what should it be?

[Flame]

I dont care for the name, and i dont think it should be penalty so it show the forth suit and a tolerance to partner suit.

[Gerben42]

What's in a name

Shouldn't Dbl be penalty since the 4th suit is at the 3-level and you can use 2NT for the purpose of the snapping dragon?

Don't tickle a sleeping dragon!

[kenberg]

The name is of course unimportant except for the fact that, like many terms, it carries a reasonably specific meaning. I can imagine the double being penalty. or I can imagine it being the fourth suit with tolerance for partner's suit. I suspect that more than a few would say that it is for take out without further definition, or that it shows values and asks partner to "do something intelligent" (I always try, but my chances of succeeding will be greater if I have some idea of what the double actually shows), or some other vague description.

At any rate, I am curious as to whether there is a consensus about its meaing.

k

[pclayton]

I think a snapdragon double should go higher than 2♠, as long as it promises support instead of just tolerance. I'd vote for --> 3♥.

What else would you want to use this double for? I can't ever remember wanting to penalize a fit bid here. I suppose if its a wjs, I'll want to penalize it out of spite, but thats a different issue entirely.