[paulg]

At my BIL session next Monday (7pm UK, 2pm EDT) I intend to cover bidding opposite a strong 2NT.

I believe the default responses on BBO are the SAYC (BB-Basic) set of Stayman, Jacoby Transfers and Gerber.

However many players (throughout BBO) agree to play SAYC without understanding what it says about responding to 2NT and so expect to play more sophisticated methods.

There are a few questions I'd like to ask:

• If you play SAYC, what does a 3♠ response mean?
  
• How common is Puppet Stayman?
  
• How common are Texas transfers?
  
• How common are South African Texas transfers (4♣->4♥)?

Are there any other conventions over 2NT that you'd like to hear about?

Cheers

Paul

[vang]

imo, for B/I, best would be to have almost the same system as over 1NT. this means
- no puppet. simple/normal stayman
- transfers
- 4x the same meaning as after 1NT (4♣ gerber if they play gerber over 1NT)
- 3♠ to be discussed. one or both minors?

[DWM]

The main difference I play over 2NT compaired to 1NT is after a negative response to Stayman bidding a major is now smolen rather than 5-4 in majors get out

3♠ is still minor suit stayman

[gwnn]

the AnnaM site from where some of us learned sayc says 3♠ is s/o in one minor @ 4 level. I happen to think it's the silliest agreement ever.

[ArcLight]

>If you play SAYC, what does a 3♠ response mean?

It probably means a transfer to ♣ or is Minor Suit Stayman. It also means you are playing with someone who is springing conventions on you without discussion. Beware. Not everyone uses MSS. I've played with experts who use 2NT in response to 1M as natural, so I would not like to make assumptions.

>How common is Puppet Stayman?
In my experience, not all that common EXECPT some of those who use it tend to automatically think the rest of the world does. Be ready for a bad score.

>How common are Texas transfers?
With an "advanced" pard you have some hope of them completing the transfer. Though you take a risk ...

>How common are South African Texas transfers (4♣->4♥)?
Without discussion, you will get a Gerber response (if you are lucky). Maybe even a pass.


For BIL I'd emphasize that pick up pards may not use the same conventions you do (and expect your pards to know).

[cherdano]

Definitely Stayman, Transfers, and 4N = natural, these would be the first things to teach.

My guess for the agreements closest to being standard: 4C = Gerber, Texas Transfer, 3S = puppet to 3N to make a slam try in a minor.

[pclayton]

1. Unlike the discussion about Jacoby 2N in the other thread, I don't know that there's a lot of consensus on what 3♠ means, but I would tip the scales toward minor suit stayman. Jacoby, Texas and Gerber (even key card) would be commonplace.

However, as long as we are teaching methods to new players, I think using 3♠ as a puppet to 3N is much more useful than minor suit stayman. I think the follow-ups are actually easier. I think this treatment is somewhat standard if you opt for the puppet:

2N - 3♠
3N -

4♣ = RKC in clubs
4♦ = RKC in diamonds
4♥ = shortness in hearts; at least 9 cards in the minors
4♠ = shortness in spades; at least 9 cards in the minors
4N = 2245 or 2254

2. I don't think Puppet Stayman is that necessary in a standard context. There are substantial tradeoffs to using it, and frequently when Opener has the 5332, 3N is often a better contract even if the partnership as an eight card major fit.

I'd rather see regular stayman in use. A few bids worth defining:

A. What are 2N - 3♣ - 3♦ - 3 major? Smolen works nicely
B. What are 2N - 3♣ - 3♥ - 3♠? These should be slam tries.
C. What are 2N - 3♣ - 3 major - 4♣? Key card or natural? I play it as key card but other play it as natural.

3. What kind of Gerber are we playing? 0123, or the more modern 0314 / 1430 with 4♠ / 4N being 2 min / 2 max?

4. What is 2N - 4♠? I would suggest that this call is specifically 4-4 in the minors and invitational to slam.

5. 2N - 4N becomes exactly a 4333 and a 12 count.

[kenberg]

Some intermediates are really pretty advanced and maybe could profit from a discussion of 2N-3S, but I think most would find it more useful to discuss how responder should handle the majors when partner opens 2N. The 2N opening is somewhat infrequent and the vast majority of those, when they do occur, belong in some number of NT or some number of hearts or spades.

Most probably play that 1N-2C-2D-2H is passable. So perhaps this is the first thing: Is 2N-3C-3D-3H passable. Certainly not if you play either Puppet or Smolen over 2N, but I doubt many would play it as passable even if they play neither of these conventions. If it is not passable then there needs to be a discussion of what it shows. As far as Texas is concerned, that seems simple enough. If they play Texas over 1N, they can play it over 2N. If not over 1N, then not over 2N. I would advocate Texas over both 1N and 2N and it's easy enough to construct some hands where it's useful.

Whatever they play over 2N can be adopted as a complete package over 2C-2D-2N. Of course the 2C-2D beginning rules out some possible hands for responder, but as long as we are speaking of a lesson for intermediates, I think we can ignore that fact. Some will have been taught exotic responses to 2C, and that will complicate matters, but I guess it could be put as: After a neutral or negative response to 2C, whatever that neutral response is, and a rebid of 2N, then the system is the same as if the opening had been 2N.

The 2N opening takes up a lot of room, and it will sometimes make life difficult. Rather than work up a lot of complicated devices (even if they understand these devices, their partners won't), I think it is best to just accept some things. The other day I saw: 2N-3N-4S. Whatever one might think of opening 2N with five spades (actually he had five spades and four hearts) it would be best if he learns that after 2N-3N your next call is pass.