[WrecksVee]

Scoring: IMP

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You deal and pick up this hand. Is it best to bid 1♥, 4♥, or something else?

Comments on standard bidding and personal theories welcome.

PS: this would be a "misadventure" of Rex and Jay but we gained IMPs on the board. Rather we are asking this to resolve a personal system issue.

Thanks!

WrecksVee

[gwnn]

I like opening 4♥, but this is 1♥. In the first 2 seats, at least, that is.

[pclayton]

I have a slight preference for 1♥, but this is a reasonable 4♥ opener at these colors.

Good hand for a 3N or 4♣ NAMYATS too.

[inquiry]

I open 1♥. I do play NAMYATS, and this hand is just about a minimum for that bid. So 4♣ is an option as well.

[pbleighton]

I would bid 1H on most days, 4H on the rest.

Peter

[FrancesHinden]

This is classically a 1H opener.
But opening 4H on this, at red, is not totally absurd.

[mike777]

1H=100%
rest=0

Even Mr. Roth opens this one heart.

[whereagles]

I would open 4♥ without much qualm. Chances that we miss a slam don't compensate the trouble caused to opps.

[SoTired]

I make a disciplined 1H bid, but have no argument with 4H.

[awm]

I always bid 1♥ on these hands. As I've commented in other threads, I've been generally unimpressed by the results of preempting on good hands.

The problem is not generally that opening 4♥ will miss a slam (although it's certainly possible this could happen). What seems to happen frequently is an auction like:

4♥ - 4♠

4♥ - X - Pass - 4♠

Say partner has a decent (but not great) hand like:

Qxx
xx
QJxx
AQxx

What does he do over these auctions? Bidding 5♥ on only doubleton, no ruffing value, and mostly slow cards doesn't seem right. Double could win but opposite a "normal" preempt (say x KQJTxxxx xx xx) 4♠ will often make, quite possibly with an overtrick. It seems normal for partner to pass with this hand, but opposite the "good hand" we chose to preempt it seems likely that 4♥ was making, 5♥ has good chances, and 4♠X will frequently fail by multiple tricks.

Of course you can "solve" this problem by opener doubling, but opener has something like 1.5 defensive tricks and there are many hands where preempting and then doubling on an offensive-oriented hand with one extra side defensive trick leads to a huge disaster.

[hrothgar]

If I had the option, I'd open 3NT or 4♣ as a NAMYATS type bid.
Absent this agreement, I'd open 1♥

I would not consider opening 4♥ as dealer.

[han]

Clear 1H for me, I don't preempt with good hands (I don't play Namyats, that would be a different story).

[mikeh]

I play Namyats (well, a version of it) but I would not use it on this hand: the hand is not good enough: I require about 8.5 tricks as my expectancy: when you start lowering your requirements, you may get to use the bid more often, but you make slam bidding by partner more difficult, and the purpose of Namyats is to facilitate slam bidding, even tho most of the time one just plays game.

And I wouldn't open 4♥ altho I echo Frances' comment that doing so at red is not absurd. For me this is a 1♥ bid, if only so that partner can trust my preempts: the strong (namyats) and the weak (4♥). And it is not as if I can forsee any common rebid problems that rebidding ♥s (or passing) won't solve.

[neilkaz]

This is a very straightforward 1♥ for me unless playing namyats.

I don't care for a 4♥ preempt with this much defence and only 7♥ and a very sound 1 level opener.

If you preempt 4♥ with this in 1st or 2nd seat, PD has no way to differentiate between your hand here and a hand like KQJTxxxx in ♥, possibly with a side honor that might help take a trick.

If you preempt 4♥ in 3rd seat (certainly very reasonable) once in a while PD missguesses in comp, although I'd open 4♥ in 3rd seat with this.

.. neilkaz..

[brianshark]

Not good enough for my Namyats (I also need 8.5 tricks). 4♥ irks me.

Simple 1♥ opener for me. Your allowed to have a good suit to open on the one level believe it or not.

[EricK]

neilkaz, on Feb 8 2007, 02:51 AM, said:

If you preempt 4♥ with this in 1st or 2nd seat, PD has no way to differentiate between your hand here and a hand like KQJTxxxx in ♥, possibly with a side honor that might help take a trick.

But conversely, if you pre-empt 4♥ with this in 1st or 2nd seat, opponents have no way to differentiate between your hand here and a hand like KQJTxxxx in ♥, possibly with a side honor that might help take a trick.

As Reese said, "A pre-empt which is always weak is a blunt sword". Maybe opponents are LOTT advocates who often leave in a double of (4♥) X (P) and your strong pre-empt allows you to make a doubled game. The wider the range of your pre-empt, the harder it is for opps to know what to do - let you play there, make you play there doubled, bid a game, bid a slam.

That's not to say that opening 4♥ will always work out well. Of course it won't. But I really felt someone ought to make a case for a 4♥ opening.

[whereagles]

hey, I can make a case for opening 4♥. But why bother? Nobody listens to me.. lol