[thebiker]

You are playing a Multi 2D (weak 2Ma 6-10, or bal 19-20, Any 4441, 18-21) and the auction goes:

2D (P) 2H (2S)
P (P) X (P)

In the absence of any firm agreements as to what partners double shows
what hand type / hand types would you most expect partner to hold??
Should this double be for Penalty or Takeout or either ?

The only arrangements you can rely on are:
Partners possible responses after 2D are:
2D To play opposite a W2H (does not show hearts)
2S To play opposite a W2S (does not show spades), but has non serious / serious interest in hearts opposite a W2H
2NT ART asks partner for further definition of the 2D bid , in particular asks whether or no the possible W2Ma is bad or good in context. Responder expects to go reach game opposite non mimimum W2Ma
3H To play in 3H or 3S opposite a W2H or W2S

regards

Brian Keable (thebiker)

[MickyB]

Penalties. If responder wanted to compete to 3♥ over 2♠ he should have bid 2♠ in the first place.

[thebiker]

Perhaps this isnt as interesting as I thought

Seems perfect reasonable to play as penalty double
Responder could be 4144 or similar with good values and take an easy penalty

but couldnt he/she be short in the majors with good values looking for partner to convert with a W2S hand?

does anyone think that two-way doubles in this sort of position may be worthwhile?



regards

thebiker.

[csdenmark]

thebiker, on Dec 25 2006, 10:38 PM, said:

Perhaps this isnt as interesting as I thought

Seems perfect reasonable to play as penalty double
Responder could be 4144 or similar with good values and take an easy penalty

but couldnt he/she be short in the majors with good values looking for partner to convert with a W2S hand?

does anyone think that two-way doubles in this sort of position may be worthwhile?



regards

thebiker.

Not 4-1-4-4, then he will raise to 3♥. 6-1 fit always acceptable for partscore.

Create a FD-file. If you post your convention card it will help you to get these kind of difficult sequences right. Anyhow the creation process will help you to ensure your carefully thoughts have been right.

Your partner need to know what the double means as it is alert-requiring. Maybe ask your partner what DBL means here Brian.

[helene_t]

I think it's common to play
2♦-(2♠)-X
as P/C. For reasons of symmetry I would assume the same here. Except, of course, if opener's pass of 2♠ already showed hearts.

[awm]

This double has to be penalty. Let's see what we know:

(1) Opener has a weak two bid. With one of the strong options he would not pass 2♠.

(2) Responder does not have a good fit for hearts. With a good heart fit he bids 2♠ (pass/correct) and not 2♥.

(3) If opener has a weak 2♥, then we don't want to compete to 3♥. Most of the time on this auction opener will have a weak 2♥. Thus double as pass/correct will often lead to 3♥, when we already said responder has no fit there.

(4) If opener has a weak 2♠, then the opponents have missed out on their huge heart fit. After all, opener probably has at most three hearts in a weak 2♠ bid, and responder has at most 2♥ to be bidding 2♥ rather than 2♠. So even though their 2♠ contract will likely fail, there is little incentive to double it as this will push them into their much superior heart contract.

[Halo]

An unusual situation, and I hope I would follow exactly the same reasoning as awm - and quickly too because in my jurisdiction the penalty double in this position is now alertable!

[csdenmark]

Halo, on Dec 26 2006, 07:23 PM, said:

An unusual situation, and I hope I would follow exactly the same reasoning as awm - and quickly too because in my jurisdiction the penalty double in this position is now alertable!

Except when 2♦ opening means natural 11-19HcP, 5+♦ anybody playing opposite me must alert and explain all bids to the end. So please be sure you know exactly yourself how you treat your features. Competitive sequences inclusive of course.

[FrancesHinden]

Penalties.
My simple rule after a multi is that
2D (2-major) x is 'take-out' (i.e. only to play opposite length) but that all other doubles are penalties.

This is an interesting sequence, because it is also possible to play is as 'to play only if they've bid your major' e.g. you have a goodish 2254 distribution and want to compete to 3H if partner has hearts. I'm not sure which hand type is more common - they are both quite rare (if you try a simulation you'll discover this auction itself is extremely rare, never mind the how frequently you either have penalty double or a hand that wants to compete and can't tell which suit partner has).