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Winstonm, on Nov 19 2006, 07:03 PM, said:
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Many players have adopted an artificial relay (cheapest bid) over 1♣-2♣ and 1♦-2♦ to show either a minimum balanced minimum hand or a minimum unbalanced hand. I was wondering if this type of concept might not be extended specifically to the auction...
Ben, I think you are comparing apples/oragnes here. In 1C/2C and 1D/2D we have a known fit so the goal now is to find the right strain and level between only two choices: NT and the minor.
In 1C-1D there are no such assurances of a playable fit and to launch into an artificial auction at this point is of no value unless the 1C is defined or the 1D is defined or both are defined (best case).
Well what is defined after 1♣-1♦ is that opener is unlikely to have a five card major (bidding and rebidding the major to show five is a little sketchy in this 1♥ as any unbalanced minimum), and responder lacks a number of hand types (no 4 card major unless near gf, no balanced 15-17, no balanced 9-12, no gf raise of clubs, no limit raise of clubs.
The real reason that I (as opposed to most people) need a structure like this is to show balanced 17-19 and balanced 20-21. I need the later case because my 2NT is not natural. This isn't a problem with a 1M response to 1minor, as I have a method for that auction already. IF you postulate that responder will not have a four card major unless he is strongish, the need to bid 1H or 1S naturally is reduced (same reason why these are artificial after 1m-2m).
It will be interesting to see what hands cause problem using this method. I have already used bridgebrowser to download hundreds of hands that allow a 1D response to 1C to see how the auctions might develop. A couple things become clear. Responder with strong slam interest and a four card major, just bids his major over openers 1H or 1S. Opener needs a way to show three suiters (including 5431 with 3 card diamond support). Responder when weak need never ask for openers second suit. The five card major (when opening 1C) is the only one without a reasonable sequence so far.
The normal hands are easy enough, a 2♣ rebid, a 1NT rebid (the big hand), the 2NT rebid (ther bigger hand), 2H, 2S rebids (reverses), and oddly 2D raise which approaches a reverse.
Here is what I am toying with...
1C-1D-1H-1S <<---- 1H unbalanced minimum, 1S asking bid
---1NT = 4H
---2C = 4S
---2D = 4D (an immediate diamond raise is stronger!)
---2H = 4415 or 4405 (both majors)
---2S = three suiter, short heart
---2NT = three suiter, short spade
The question is what is forcing? After 1♠ by responder, if a major fit is found, it is game force. Also after 1C-1D-1M, I am now turning xyz off, so that responders 2C and 2D rebids over 1H or 1S are natural, NF.