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Can you find game here?
#2 Guest_Jlall_*
Posted 2006-November-08, 09:08
1S-3C seems like the only fitting start (glad this is available by the methods). I want to get my club suit in for sure and my hand is worth an invite on playing strength, so I like this option. If partner were to bid 3N I would pull to 4C though (playing 3N looks really wrong with this hand). Maybe that's wrong...actually I remember a hand from meckstroths book where he bid 3C with an 8 bagger then pulled 3N... and 5C had no play and 3N was cold (but he wrapped 5C 
). Anyways, in this case I would expect opener to bid 3H so a 4C rebid looks right(without the ace or king of clubs I would again not want to play 3N. It's possible that we have enough tricks outside of clubs if partners spades are very strong, but I'm sure it's percentage to angle towards clubs) and opener would raise to 5C. Hopefully this auction was not too double dummy 
). Anyways, in this case I would expect opener to bid 3H so a 4C rebid looks right(without the ace or king of clubs I would again not want to play 3N. It's possible that we have enough tricks outside of clubs if partners spades are very strong, but I'm sure it's percentage to angle towards clubs) and opener would raise to 5C. Hopefully this auction was not too double dummy
#3
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Posted 2006-November-08, 11:00
South's hand is not weak enough to bid 3C if you play wjs. Maybe Justin is playing a different system and direct 3C is invitational? If you play standard 2/1, I think the following sequence is reasonable:
1S - 1N
2H - 3C
4C - 4D/5C.
1S - 1N
2H - 3C
4C - 4D/5C.
Senshu
#4 Guest_Jlall_*
Posted 2006-November-08, 11:38
The initial post said "Invitational jump shifts to 1M." What I play or you play doesn't really matter, it's what the system in use was since that is the context the problem occured in. Perhaps I misinterpreted inviational jump shifts to 1M, but I thought that meant 1S-3C is natural and invitational.
BTW I hope 3C being a WJS is not standard 2/1...I would have thought strong was
BTW I hope 3C being a WJS is not standard 2/1
...I would have thought strong was
#5
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Posted 2006-November-08, 11:49
The hand has 5 losers. Your average min opener will contain 3 cover cards, so game is definitely in the pic. As for the bidding,
1♠ 3♣
is definitely a possibility but I don't want pard to pass it with, say,
AQxxx
Qxx
Axx
xx
so I'll bid more aggressively and start with 2♣. After hearing 2♥, the hint is there that game is the limit, but it's still too early to take that decision, so I'd go
1♠ 2♣
2♥ 3♣
4♣ 5♣
pass
I don't think this is double-dummy, but hey it's hard to stay unbiased with both hands shown, so maybe it is after all
1♠ 3♣
is definitely a possibility but I don't want pard to pass it with, say,
AQxxx
Qxx
Axx
xx
so I'll bid more aggressively and start with 2♣. After hearing 2♥, the hint is there that game is the limit, but it's still too early to take that decision, so I'd go
1♠ 2♣
2♥ 3♣
4♣ 5♣
pass
I don't think this is double-dummy, but hey it's hard to stay unbiased with both hands shown, so maybe it is after all
#6
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Posted 2006-November-08, 12:26
As a person who plays invitational jump shifts in some auctions, this hand seems ill-suited for that action. However, it seems ill-suited for any other action for that matter.
I'll bid a forcing 1NT, just to give partner an easy 2S rebid, because 4S is still a plausible contract. If he declines this opportunity by passing (semi-forcing), I'll expect a balance and compete in clubs. If he makes any other call, I'll blast at IMP's to 5C and hope the confusion helps the play.
I'll bid a forcing 1NT, just to give partner an easy 2S rebid, because 4S is still a plausible contract. If he declines this opportunity by passing (semi-forcing), I'll expect a balance and compete in clubs. If he makes any other call, I'll blast at IMP's to 5C and hope the confusion helps the play.
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-P.J. Painter.
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#7
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Posted 2006-November-08, 12:40
Jlall, on Nov 8 2006, 12:38 PM, said:
The initial post said "Invitational jump shifts to 1M." What I play or you play doesn't really matter, it's what the system in use was since that is the context the problem occured in. Perhaps I misinterpreted inviational jump shifts to 1M, but I thought that meant 1S-3C is natural and invitational.
BTW I hope 3C being a WJS is not standard 2/1...I would have thought strong was
BTW I hope 3C being a WJS is not standard 2/1
...I would have thought strong wasThanks. It is me who missed "Invitational jump shifts to 1M".
Senshu
#8
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Posted 2006-November-08, 15:17
I guess at imps I want to force to game somehow with my 8 card suit. So I will not bid your system bid of 3clubs invite. I will assume we play 1nt forcing so I will start with that and then jump to 5clubs?
1s=1nt
2h=5c?
1s=1nt
2h=5c?
#9 Guest_Jlall_*
Posted 2006-November-08, 15:22
Forcing to game with this is pretty huge when partner just opens 1S, and is really huge when partner opens 1S and rebids 2H. Sure there are some perfect minimums but why shouldn't partner have some heart wastage?
#10
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Posted 2006-November-08, 15:30
<skiped>
With kind regards
Uwe Gebhardt (P_Marlowe)
Uwe Gebhardt (P_Marlowe)
#11
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Posted 2006-November-08, 15:51
mike777, on Nov 8 2006, 04:17 PM, said:
I guess at imps I want to force to game somehow with my 8 card suit. So I will not bid your system bid of 3clubs invite. I will assume we play 1nt forcing so I will start with that and then jump to 5clubs?
1s=1nt
2h=5c?
1s=1nt
2h=5c?
To force to game with such a hand? I don't think so. This hand will not provide much help if pd can't support C (stiff or void), maybe a ruff of H (S as trump).
Senshu
#12
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Posted 2006-November-08, 16:35
I like the 3♣ bid myself.
"Champions aren't made in gyms, champions are made from something they have deep inside them - a desire, a dream, a vision. They have to have last-minute stamina, they have to be a little faster, they have to have the skill and the will. But the will must be stronger than the skill. " - M. Ali
#13
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Posted 2006-November-09, 10:05
I consider this hand worth 2/1 although I will regret bidding 2C many times I'm sure, especially when partner bids 2H. However the upside is that when you can make game opposite 3 bare aces and the 10 C I am willing to risk the 2/1 stretch, big deal.
My time playing indicates there are times to push and times to reduce your hand values, this is a pus. I admit this is not a hand I would open 1C, the fact partner has opened 1S does improve my hand and I have no way nor desire to go quietly. As it is not my habit to place 8 card suits as dummies, I plan to bid clubs and clubs and clubs. The object is to reach a game that has play, it does not always have to be a good game.
My time playing indicates there are times to push and times to reduce your hand values, this is a pus. I admit this is not a hand I would open 1C, the fact partner has opened 1S does improve my hand and I have no way nor desire to go quietly. As it is not my habit to place 8 card suits as dummies, I plan to bid clubs and clubs and clubs. The object is to reach a game that has play, it does not always have to be a good game.
#14
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Posted 2006-November-19, 22:53
This is routine:
1S 2c 2H 3c 3d(waiting, 4th suit) 3nt or 3S (either could work out better)(3S is probably the better bid since you need help to run clubs in 3nt).
This responding hand is an abolute gameforce...why distort with 1nt when you have an 8 card suit.
1S 2c 2H 3c 3d(waiting, 4th suit) 3nt or 3S (either could work out better)(3S is probably the better bid since you need help to run clubs in 3nt).
This responding hand is an abolute gameforce...why distort with 1nt when you have an 8 card suit.
#15
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Posted 2006-November-19, 22:59
I'm going to treat this as an invitational club hand - but not invitational to 3N as I will pull that to 4C.
Not knowing exactly the methods described, I'll use my own sequence.
1S-2C
2H-3C* Non-forcing in the auction due to the possible misfit
5C-P
Not knowing exactly the methods described, I'll use my own sequence.
1S-2C
2H-3C* Non-forcing in the auction due to the possible misfit
5C-P
"Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere."
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How do you bid these hands playing 2/1. Invitational jump shifts to 1M. if you ahve a fancy gadget then let me know