[luis]

You have AKxx in clubs.

The auction:

PD You
1s 2h
4c 4h
4n foo
5n ?

4c is a splinter with support for hearts.

Do you count the club king?

I have a fun discussion with a pd and we are conducting a local poll, let's query the opinion of my fellow BBF friends.
(I won't reveal my position until we declare the poll/discussion closed. I want the truth not support)

[keylime]

Ouch, this is rough, ruff, ruf...you get the message. After consultation - since you got AK(x), yep, I'm counting it, even though I'm used to specific king, which might help matters here.

[kfgauss]

Without any discussion, I'd show it. With discussion, either way is reasonable.

You don't need 6C to ask about clubs, so perhaps the ask in the splinter suit could be used to ask for Kings excluding the splinter suit or some such thing while keeping 5NT asking for all kings.

I also tend to play specific kings.

Andy

PS You didn't tell me how many other Kings I had, so how can I answer your poll!

[mikestar]

In most of my partnerships, we don't splinter with a stiff Ace, so the King is seldom needed. I don't count it. (I would count it in a casual partnership with no discussion--but I would try no to play spinters with ssuch a partner.)

[inquiry]

Quote

In most of my partnerships, we don't splinter with a stiff Ace, so the King is seldom needed. I don't count it. (I would count it in a casual partnership with no discussion--but I would try no to play spinters with ssuch a partner.)

But this time you have the ACE in the splinter suit... you may have overlooked your holding of AKxx in clubs....

[mikestar]

Quote

But this time you have the ACE in the splinter suit... you may have overlooked your holding of AKxx in clubs....

Point well taken--I had overlooked the specific example and was addressing the general question. Even when we splinter with a stiff Ace, the King isn't always valuable, and when we have AK oppoite a splinter the King isn't always valuable. I would still advocate not counting it as a matter of partnership agreement. This is also in accord with the quite common agreement not to count an Ace opposite a known void--the Ace might be useful, but it may well not be.

These considerations argue forcefully for Specific King (and Voidwood).

[DrTodd13]

With AKxx, I definitely count the K. Kxx is another story.
K is not necessarily wasted in this scenario if pd has a
singleton. The K is then a 50% trick and will enable a
discard later. In fact, on this auction, partner is guaranteed
to have a singleton. He couldn't bid 4N with a club void.
So, the K in Kxx could be useful even opposite a singleton
but I might have to look at the rest of the hand to see if
that discard can be helpful to him. If helpful, I would
probably show it.

[Free]

I'd show my King, because we have all the aces, p can discard anything on my King (maybe on my ace to)... But it's still a good question

[Gerben47]

Good question. I bid what I have, which is the king of clubs.

Ancient Chinese Wisdom:
Why ask the question if you don't want the answer?

I'm used to specific kings as well, playing foo+1 as specific kings and foo+2 as number of kings in the auction you mentioned (and in fact 4S as RKCB hearts).

What if these are the hands?

AKxxxx
AKxx
Ax
x

x
QJxxx
Qxx
AKxx

If you don't bid your king, don't expect to find the grand.

[luis]

Quote

Good question. I bid what I have, which is the king of clubs.

Ancient Chinese Wisdom:
Why ask the question if you don't want the answer?

I'm used to specific kings as well, playing foo+1 as specific kings and foo+2 as number of kings in the auction you mentioned (and in fact 4S as RKCB hearts).

What if these are the hands?

AKxxxx
AKxx
Ax
x

x
QJxxx
Qxx
AKxx

If you don't bid your king, don't expect to find the grand.

I think you make 7 without the cK here.....
Now some comments:
If pd want to asks for Aces and then Kings why does he splinter in clubs before ?
What kind of hand may need the cK for 7 and does not make 7 without it?

[Ulrikbro]

I dont like answer the poll, so i havent. - I feel showing specific kings after 5nt is far superior, as very often u find that some kings are important while other are irrelevant.
You have no chance to know if p have use for ur singleton k or not.
Playing with a random p i will propably count it in - but its more a question of psychologi than good reasoning.

[Trpltrbl]

Quote

You have AKxx in clubs.

The auction:

PD You
1s 2h
4c 4h
4n foo
5n ?

4c is a splinter with support for hearts.

Do you count the club king?

I have a fun discussion with a pd and we are conducting a local poll, let's query the opinion of my fellow BBF friends.
(I won't reveal my position until we declare the poll/discussion closed. I want the truth not support)

Not sure what the problem is? My pd is asking me a straight forward simple question, isn't he/she ? SO why not answer with what y have ? Having 2 people in same pdship trying to mastermind a hand is never !!! going to work. Question -- Answer.
Simple enough. If my pd wanted to know if I had a certain K, he/she can always bid that suit at 6 level asking for that specific King. Complicating things that aren't complicated is only going to hurt r brain

Mike ;D