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What should dummy do? Laws 42, 43, and 46, and possibly others

#21 User is online   pescetom 

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Posted 2018-February-10, 12:58

View Postpran, on 2018-February-10, 10:54, said:

If Dummy is not the last to play to the trick he shall play the lowest correct card that according to his knowledge will win the trick.
If he is unsure then that means his highest card (save for continuous ranking cards)

Is that your own interpretation or is it written somewhere?
The Law as it stands does not say that.

View PostBudH, on 2018-February-10, 11:08, said:

It would be easier if "cover cheaply" was used here and "win it" only used when dummy is last to play to the trick.

That would be better, but it still doesn't cover the situation where the dummy is second to play and holds more than one card that will beat both the card played by LHO and the highest card held by RHO.
I would be more in favour of disallowing such calls and obliging declarer to think for himself.
Plus of course giving dummy the power to refuse any call that does not conform to Law 46 or the cards available.
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#22 User is offline   BudH 

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Posted 2018-February-10, 13:17

View Postpescetom, on 2018-February-10, 12:58, said:

Is that your own interpretation or is it written somewhere?
The Law as it stands does not say that.


That would be better, but it still doesn't cover the situation where the dummy is second to play and holds more than one card that will beat both the card played by LHO and the highest card held by RHO.
I would be more in favour of disallowing such calls and obliging declarer to think for himself.
Plus of course giving dummy the power to refuse any call that does not conform to Law 46 or the cards available.

The idea of "cover cheaply" or something similar is "play the lowest card which is higher than any card played to this trick thus far".
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#23 User is offline   barmar 

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Posted 2018-February-10, 13:43

View PostBudH, on 2018-February-10, 11:08, said:

It would be easier if "cover cheaply" was used here and "win it" only used when dummy is last to play to the trick.

In my experience, that's what is actually done. I don't think I've ever heard anyone say "win" when dummy was not last to play.

The Law doesn't say this explicitly, but in practice it's the only reasonable thing to do.

#24 User is offline   blackshoe 

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Posted 2018-February-10, 16:01

It may be the only reasonable thing to do, but that won't stop people from doing something else. I have seen declarers say "win it" when dummy is second to play to the trick.
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#25 User is online   pescetom 

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Posted 2018-February-10, 16:25

View Postbarmar, on 2018-February-10, 13:43, said:

In my experience, that's what is actually done. I don't think I've ever heard anyone say "win" when dummy was not last to play.

The Law doesn't say this explicitly, but in practice it's the only reasonable thing to do.


I agree that is it rare to hear anyone say "win" when this leaves things to the judgement of the dummy, and I certainly wouldn't be happy if my partner did so.
For that matter I have never heard anyone indicate a rank not present in the current suit, but I gather such things do happen.
Either I haven't been playing bridge long enough or I am just lucky :)
But Laws should cover any reasonable possibility in a coherent manner.
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#26 User is offline   weejonnie 

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Posted 2018-February-11, 05:00

View Postpran, on 2018-February-10, 10:54, said:

No problem!

If Dummy is not the last to play to the trick he shall play the lowest correct card that according to his knowledge will win the trick.
If he is unsure then that means his highest card (save for continuous ranking cards)

And dummy is a pro that has counted the hands whilst his partner is a client who doesn't . . .
No matter how well you know the laws, there is always something that you'll forget. That is why we have a book.
Get the facts. No matter what people say, get the facts from both sides BEFORE you make a ruling or leave the table.
Remember - just because a TD is called for one possible infraction, it does not mean that there are no others.
In a judgement case - always refer to other TDs and discuss the situation until they agree your decision is correct.
The hardest rulings are inevitably as a result of failure of being called at the correct time. ALWAYS penalize both sides if this happens.
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#27 User is offline   barmar 

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Posted 2018-February-12, 09:30

View Postblackshoe, on 2018-February-10, 16:01, said:

It may be the only reasonable thing to do, but that won't stop people from doing something else. I have seen declarers say "win it" when dummy is second to play to the trick.

Has it happened in cases where it required some judgement, like keeping count of the suit? I wouldn't have a problem if dummy had AKQx and the Jack was led.

#28 User is offline   blackshoe 

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Posted 2018-February-12, 14:12

I don't know, Barry. I do know most of the cases where I've seen it weren't as obvious as your example.
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#29 User is offline   lamford 

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Posted 2018-February-12, 17:16

View Postbarmar, on 2018-February-10, 13:43, said:

In my experience, that's what is actually done. I don't think I've ever heard anyone say "win" when dummy was not last to play.

You have not lived. Many people at Young Chelsea flippantly say "win", when dummy has a singleton king, or "small" when dummy has a singleton ace.
I prefer to give the lawmakers credit for stating things for a reason - barmar
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#30 User is offline   blackshoe 

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Posted 2018-February-12, 18:23

The One is the smallest card in the suit, isn't it? B-)
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As for tv, screw it. You aren't missing anything. -- Ken Berg
I have come to realise it is futile to expect or hope a regular club game will be run in accordance with the laws. -- Jillybean
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#31 User is online   pescetom 

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Posted 2018-February-13, 08:14

View Postblackshoe, on 2018-February-12, 18:23, said:

The One is the smallest card in the suit, isn't it? B-)


It actually was, until the French Revolution B-)
Although some say until the 14th century.
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#32 User is offline   barmar 

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Posted 2018-February-13, 10:47

View Postlamford, on 2018-February-12, 17:16, said:

You have not lived. Many people at Young Chelsea flippantly say "win", when dummy has a singleton king, or "small" when dummy has a singleton ace.

Oh, I've seen those jokey designations many times. You can say practically anything when dummy has a singleton in the suit led, as long as it doesn't designate some other suit. I think I've even heard "try to win" when dummy has a singleton that can't possibly win -- he sheepishly apologizes for his failure.

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