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Sanity check on reopening

Poll: Sanity check on reopening (44 member(s) have cast votes)

How do you rate a reopening X

  1. routine easy everyday there's a Y in the day (5 votes [11.36%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 11.36%

  2. not textbook but okay (1 votes [2.27%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 2.27%

  3. a bit exxagerated but I would (8 votes [18.18%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 18.18%

  4. pass or X both reasonable, no preference (10 votes [22.73%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 22.73%

  5. a bit too much for me (11 votes [25.00%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 25.00%

  6. crazy (9 votes [20.45%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 20.45%

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#1 User is offline   apollo1201 

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Posted 2017-December-29, 09:28

IMPs, all red, you deal and pass the following collection (system kindof SAYC+ with 12HCP opening)

AJ9x
K9xx
JTx
Qx

LHO preempts 3C, passed back to you.

pass 3C pass pass
?

I'm asking for a sanity check and will explain why later.

So pass or X ? Yeah, I know Qx C are not the best assets of the hands...so I didn't ask what you think of 3NT bid :D
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#2 User is offline   LBengtsson 

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Posted 2017-December-29, 14:10

pass. pass. pass. pass. pass...
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#3 User is offline   nige1 

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Posted 2017-December-29, 20:39


imps. SAYC with 12 HCP openings.
I rank
1. Double = T/O. Partner won't expect more.
2. Pass = NAT. Seemingly safe but not without risk.
3. 3N = NAT? Foolhardy and might be misinterpretated.

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#4 User is offline   FelicityR 

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Posted 2017-December-29, 22:27

One rule I was taught by my late bridge teacher - a Life Master - many years ago is never try to balance at the three level with a balanced hand (4333 4432) even if your hand is near an opening bid. This was said in reference to a weak two opening raised to the three level pre-emptively. Given that you are vulnerable and the opponents are too, and it is a second hand pre-empt, and that some opponents will not make a barrage raise to four clubs with a desired hand, it's an easy pass for me.
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#5 User is offline   PhilG007 

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Posted 2017-December-30, 02:02

Anyone who bids on this tawdry collection is either lion hearted
or should be referred to a good psychiatrist. My conscience is clear...I PASS
There are occasions when protecting partners pass are not applicable...this is
definitely one of them...
"It is not enough to be a good player, you must also play well"
- Dr Tarrasch(1862-1934)German Chess Grandmaster

Bridge is a game where you have two opponents...and often three(!)


"Any palooka can take tricks with Aces and Kings; the true expert shows his prowess
by how he handles the two's and three's" - Mollo's Hideous Hog
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#6 User is offline   PhilG007 

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Posted 2017-December-30, 02:13

View Postnige1, on 2017-December-29, 20:39, said:


imps. SAYC with 12 HCP openings.
I rank
1. Double = T/O. Partner won't expect more.
2. Pass = NAT. Seemingly safe but not without risk.
3. 3N = NAT? Foolhardy and might be misinterpretated.


Errrr... correct me if I'm wrong but I can only see 11 hcp in that hand(?)
"It is not enough to be a good player, you must also play well"
- Dr Tarrasch(1862-1934)German Chess Grandmaster

Bridge is a game where you have two opponents...and often three(!)


"Any palooka can take tricks with Aces and Kings; the true expert shows his prowess
by how he handles the two's and three's" - Mollo's Hideous Hog
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#7 User is offline   MrAce 

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Posted 2017-December-30, 02:53

This is a borderline decision. I would have opened previous round.
I personally would always double at MP but at IMPs it is a bit more risky.
Just because we are coming from pass and pd won't expect more does not change the possibility that 3 level can be already too high for us.
Overall I would DBL but it is not clear cut and pass is reasonable as well.
"Genius has its own limitations, however stupidity has no such boundaries!"
"It's only when a mosquito lands on your testicles that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence!"

"Well to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion, of course without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter in a different perspective and without being condemning of one's view's and by trying to make it objectified, and by considering each and every one's valid opinion, I honestly believe that I completely forgot what I was going to say."





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#8 User is offline   gordontd 

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Posted 2017-December-30, 03:56

View PostPhilG007, on 2017-December-30, 02:13, said:

Errrr... correct me if I'm wrong but I can only see 11 hcp in that hand(?)

Well what do you expect- itís a passed hand!
Gordon Rainsford
London UK
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#9 User is offline   MrAce 

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Posted 2017-December-30, 06:12

View Postgordontd, on 2017-December-30, 03:56, said:

Well what do you expect- it's a passed hand!


Posted Image
"Genius has its own limitations, however stupidity has no such boundaries!"
"It's only when a mosquito lands on your testicles that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence!"

"Well to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion, of course without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter in a different perspective and without being condemning of one's view's and by trying to make it objectified, and by considering each and every one's valid opinion, I honestly believe that I completely forgot what I was going to say."





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#10 User is offline   apollo1201 

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Posted 2017-December-30, 07:02

Thanks for your comments, as you had guessed I had Xed (thinking my initial pass made it clear I didn't have a powerhouse).

My inexperienced partner had paid due respect to the stop sign, but she never plays in tempo as she needs more time to think. RHO had raised concerns about my reopening after partner's "hesitation". Especially after I tabled dummy. I really thought, though, it was a bit aggressive but quite ok (I tend to reopen easily). Facing a real hestitation from a more experienced partner, I'd have passed as I knew the X was not cut clear.

Partner had something close to Kx(x) ATxxx Kx(x) Axx and passed initially (I think it is quite clear to pass), but now jumped to 4H and wrapped up 11 tricks after guessing everything right incl. picking up the trumps that split J - Qxx.

Other table +200 when teammates commited the same preempt red 2nd hand with KJ 7th and 2 queens.

No TD called finally when opps learnt about my partner's status and her funny comment "your take-out double is weak".

But I still wanted to check...

Nice year-end to all!
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#11 User is offline   PhilG007 

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Posted 2017-December-30, 09:15

View Postgordontd, on 2017-December-30, 03:56, said:

Well what do you expect- itís a passed hand!

Read Nige's post....Where is the phantom 1 point that he sees
but others don't(?!)
"It is not enough to be a good player, you must also play well"
- Dr Tarrasch(1862-1934)German Chess Grandmaster

Bridge is a game where you have two opponents...and often three(!)


"Any palooka can take tricks with Aces and Kings; the true expert shows his prowess
by how he handles the two's and three's" - Mollo's Hideous Hog
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#12 User is offline   Joe_Old 

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Posted 2017-December-30, 09:17

I know that I'm adding this after a spoiler, but this is a routine (but very borderline) double. It's also a double if you are in fourth seat and LHO dealt and bid 3. In every expert partnership I know, protecting partner when you're in the balancing seat is a must, and two four card majors makes this even more necessary.

Granted, there are wasted values in the minors, and if the hand was xxxx xxxx AQx KQ, I'd pass.
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#13 User is offline   PhilG007 

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Posted 2017-December-30, 09:20

View Postapollo1201, on 2017-December-30, 07:02, said:

Thanks for your comments, as you had guessed I had Xed (thinking my initial pass made it clear I didn't have a powerhouse).

My inexperienced partner had paid due respect to the stop sign, but she never plays in tempo as she needs more time to think. RHO had raised concerns about my reopening after partner's "hesitation". Especially after I tabled dummy. I really thought, though, it was a bit aggressive but quite ok (I tend to reopen easily). Facing a real hestitation from a more experienced partner, I'd have passed as I knew the X was not cut clear.

Partner had something close to Kx(x) ATxxx Kx(x) Axx and passed initially (I think it is quite clear to pass), but now jumped to 4H and wrapped up 11 tricks after guessing everything right incl. picking up the trumps that split J - Qxx.

Other table +200 when teammates commited the same preempt red 2nd hand with KJ 7th and 2 queens.

No TD called finally when opps learnt about my partner's status and her funny comment "your take-out double is weak".

But I still wanted to check...

Nice year-end to all!

You were very fortunate.. you got away with it ...THIS time(!)
"It is not enough to be a good player, you must also play well"
- Dr Tarrasch(1862-1934)German Chess Grandmaster

Bridge is a game where you have two opponents...and often three(!)


"Any palooka can take tricks with Aces and Kings; the true expert shows his prowess
by how he handles the two's and three's" - Mollo's Hideous Hog
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#14 User is offline   apollo1201 

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Posted 2017-December-30, 09:22

View PostPhilG007, on 2017-December-30, 09:20, said:

You were very fortunate.. you got away with it ...THIS time(!)


Begginer's luck😊
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#15 User is offline   PhilG007 

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Posted 2017-December-30, 09:25

View PostJoe_Old, on 2017-December-30, 09:17, said:

I know that I'm adding this after a spoiler, but this is a routine (but very borderline) double. It's also a double if you are in fourth seat and LHO dealt and bid 3. In every expert partnership I know, protecting partner when you're in the balancing seat is a must, and two four card majors makes this even more necessary.

Granted, there are wasted values in the minors, and if the hand was xxxx xxxx AQx KQ, I'd pass.

"Granted there are wasted values in the minors"
Exactly the reason why you should pass. Of course,fortune is allied to the brave..
but fortune can be fickle....
"It is not enough to be a good player, you must also play well"
- Dr Tarrasch(1862-1934)German Chess Grandmaster

Bridge is a game where you have two opponents...and often three(!)


"Any palooka can take tricks with Aces and Kings; the true expert shows his prowess
by how he handles the two's and three's" - Mollo's Hideous Hog
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#16 User is offline   Jinksy 

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Posted 2017-December-30, 09:42

View PostPhilG007, on 2017-December-30, 09:15, said:

Read Nige's post....Where is the phantom 1 point that he sees
but others don't(?!)


Nigel is describing the system, not the hand.
The "4 is a transfer to 4" award goes to Jinksy - PhilKing
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#17 User is offline   Joe_Old 

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Posted 2017-December-30, 09:58

View PostPhilG007, on 2017-December-30, 09:25, said:

"Granted there are wasted values in the minors"
Exactly the reason why you should pass. Of course,fortune is allied to the brave..
but fortune can be fickle....


I guess that you don't understand the form of scoring. Red, IMPs, you stretch to reach game. Passing is understandable, but it's not winning bridge.
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#18 User is offline   Tramticket 

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Posted 2017-December-30, 10:22

This is finely balanced and state of the match might affect the decision. There is a big risk of missing a vulnerable game (or a nice penalty) if we pass. On the other hand, there is a risk of conceding 1,100 or more when RHO has a big hand and a misfit with his partner.

I would probably double - nervously!

At match points, it's an easy double.
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#19 User is offline   apollo1201 

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Posted 2017-December-30, 13:40

View PostTramticket, on 2017-December-30, 10:22, said:

I would probably double - nervously!


Let me reassure you, I was also nervous😰... especially with an inexperienced partner. Her jump to 4H almost finished me and I breathed some relief when it wasn't Xed.

But after seeing her masterizing the play for 11 tricks😱
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#20 User is offline   GrahamJson 

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Posted 2017-December-30, 16:45

Hmmm, perhaps Iím being a bit simplistic, but if a 4432 Hand isnít worth bidding at the one level I donít see how it is worth bidding at the three level.

Look at it another way. If you pass and it turns out you could have made game I dont think team mates will give you a hard time. If you double and go for 1100 on a part score hand things might be a bit different.
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