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Awesome hand with 8 diamonds

#1 User is offline   helene_t 

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Posted 2017-October-22, 06:17

Qxxx
-
Txxxxxxx
x

Matchpoints. You are red/white. LHO deals and opens 1

(1)-4-(5)-pass
(pass)-x-(pass)-?
OBAR = OverBidding At Random? --- Vampyr
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#2 User is offline   JonnyQuest 

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Posted 2017-October-22, 09:25

Can I redouble?

No?

Okay then, Pass it is.
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#3 User is offline   ggwhiz 

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Posted 2017-October-22, 09:34

A (short) crossruff in the reds?
The race may not go to the swift nor the battle to the strong. But that's the way to bet it.
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#4 User is offline   JanisW 

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Posted 2017-October-22, 12:57

What hands justify 4 followed by a double?

Partner is very unlickely to look at 3 Aces or a club-stack.
As he is on lead it also cannot be lead-directing asking for a lead... but maybe he wants to alert me to make an unorthodox play

I'll pass hoping for
1. A
2. ruff Ps K
3. lead

or
1. A
2. ruff P's A
3. lead a


regards
JW
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#5 User is offline   manudude03 

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Posted 2017-October-22, 14:01

I'm passing, but I won't try anything fancy on defense. Partner knows if they have a diamond void.
Wayne Somerville
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#6 User is online   The_Badger 

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Posted 2017-October-22, 14:33

And you thought you got lucky when RHO bid 5 :)

Nothing better than pass and hope you can 'nick' three tricks off the top.
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#7 User is offline   nige1 

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Posted 2017-October-22, 20:07

View Posthelene_t, on 2017-October-22, 06:17, said:

Q x x x - T x x x x x x x x
Matchpoints. You are red/white. LHO deals and opens 1
(1)-4-(5)-pass
(pass)-x-(pass)-?

Pass seems normal, however, I like the convention where a double by a 4-level pre-emptor says "I have a very good suit. Please bid one more unless you have good defence". e.g.
- A K Q x x x x x x x x x x
With such an agreement, I would bid 5 or 5.
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#8 User is offline   wank 

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Posted 2017-October-22, 22:55

View Postnige1, on 2017-October-22, 20:07, said:

Pass seems normal, however, I like the convention where a double by a 4-level pre-emptor says "I have a very good suit. Please bid one more unless you have good defence". e.g.
- A K Q x x x x x x x x x x
With such an agreement, I would bid 5 or 5.


there's no such convention in the pass out seat. it's so you don't bid ahead of partner when he's got a penalty double. here partner already knows we don't have a penalty double, because we didn't make one.
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#9 User is offline   rmnka447 

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Posted 2017-October-23, 01:20

Without any special agreements, such as nige1 suggested, I pass.
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#10 User is offline   helene_t 

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Posted 2017-October-23, 19:24

View PostJanisW, on 2017-October-22, 12:57, said:

What hands justify 4 followed by a double?

Good question. It wasn't discussed. It was me who bid 4 and then doubled. I had Jx-AKQxxxxx-K-AJ.
OBAR = OverBidding At Random? --- Vampyr
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#11 User is offline   JanisW 

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Posted 2017-October-24, 06:06

View Posthelene_t, on 2017-October-23, 19:24, said:

Good question. It wasn't discussed. It was me who bid 4 and then doubled. I had Jx-AKQxxxxx-K-AJ.


Of course 4 is not nonsensical, but I would've started with an X. You are a tad strong for 4 in my opinion, as partner has not acted yet. Opposite a passed hand, anything goes.
Or is 4 only bid with the clear intention of making and 3 is your highest weak jump?

Of course your LHO was pushed into bidding 5, but he non the less did so pretty much freely, as he did not have to bid at all. So partner has to be broke and there is definitely some distribution going on. Would not be too suprised if xxx,x,Ax,Kxxxxxx was put on the table and call myself lucky, that partner is the one with the void... (AKxx,Jxxx,QJ,Qxx with opener).

As I am not sure where the 3rd trick should come from and would pull 5 from partner to 5(is P even allowed to bid 5?), I think you should decide between pass and 5. The exception being that X means: I think they can make it, if you have no defence (whatever that should be on the bidding so far?), so please pull the X without a trick. Now poor partner is looking on his Q 4th in and has to decide...
X being a clear penalty-double only makes sence, if 4 is bid to make, imo.


Definitely an interesting X to talk about with Partner.

regards
JW
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#12 User is offline   manudude03 

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Posted 2017-October-24, 10:26

View PostJanisW, on 2017-October-24, 06:06, said:

Of course 4 is not nonsensical, but I would've started with an X. You are a tad strong for 4 in my opinion, as partner has not acted yet. Opposite a passed hand, anything goes.
Or is 4 only bid with the clear intention of making and 3 is your highest weak jump?

Of course your LHO was pushed into bidding 5, but he non the less did so pretty much freely, as he did not have to bid at all. So partner has to be broke and there is definitely some distribution going on. Would not be too suprised if xxx,x,Ax,Kxxxxxx was put on the table and call myself lucky, that partner is the one with the void... (AKxx,Jxxx,QJ,Qxx with opener).

As I am not sure where the 3rd trick should come from and would pull 5 from partner to 5(is P even allowed to bid 5?), I think you should decide between pass and 5. The exception being that X means: I think they can make it, if you have no defence (whatever that should be on the bidding so far?), so please pull the X without a trick. Now poor partner is looking on his Q 4th in and has to decide...
X being a clear penalty-double only makes sence, if 4 is bid to make, imo.


Definitely an interesting X to talk about with Partner.

regards
JW


I don't think the double is pure penalty, but rather values. 4H is often bid as both a weak pre-empt or a good hand where you just want to play there, and the double just shows the latter.
Wayne Somerville
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#13 User is offline   bravejason 

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Posted 2017-October-26, 13:32

How about 5 spades, gambling that partner has hearts and spades? Might be a great call. Might go down, down, down, down...
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#14 User is offline   wank 

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Posted 2017-October-30, 14:22

View Postbravejason, on 2017-October-26, 13:32, said:

How about 5 spades, gambling that partner has hearts and spades? Might be a great call. Might go down, down, down, down...


lol partner's overcalled 4H. he's not doubling for takeout. double shows a strong 4H bid with convertible values - aces. he wants you to choose between saving in 5H and trying to take 5C off. considering you've got a void in partner's suit it's not a tricky decision.
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