BBO Discussion Forums: both majors - BBO Discussion Forums

Jump to content

  • 3 Pages +
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • You cannot start a new topic
  • You cannot reply to this topic

both majors

#1 User is offline   eagles123 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 1,831
  • Joined: 2011-June-08
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:UK Near London
  • Interests:Crystal Palace

Posted 2016-July-18, 06:39



3d = preempt

imps

Spoiler



cheers

Eagles
"definitely that's what I like to play when I'm playing standard - I want to be able to bid diamonds because bidding good suits is important in bridge" - Meckstroth's opinion on weak 2 diamond
0

#2 User is offline   masse24 

  • PipPipPipPip
  • Group: Full Members
  • Posts: 341
  • Joined: 2009-April-01
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Chicago Suburbs

Posted 2016-July-18, 07:36

3 for me too. Though I don't hate 4.

It's close.
“Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.” George Carlin
1

#3 User is offline   Trinidad 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 4,531
  • Joined: 2005-October-09
  • Location:Netherlands

Posted 2016-July-18, 07:37

I don't agree with your spoiler that it is "pretty clear". However, I would bid 4 for fairly practical reasons:

It makes partner (the strong hand) declarer.
It put us in the best major.
It puts the doubler (the opponents' strong hand) on lead.

This all means that I would guess that we get a trick more than when I bid 3. And whether we go down 1 in 3 by me or down 1 in 4 by partner doesn't matter, but if we happen to be able to make our contract, then it does make a big difference.

The two biggest drawbacks of bidding 4 are that partner might
- get overly enthusiastic.
- make the wrong decision over their 5.

Those drawbacks are why I don't think it is "pretty clear", but I would bid 4 anyway.

Rik
I want my opponents to leave my table with a smile on their face and without matchpoints on their score card - in that order.
The most exciting phrase to hear in science, the one that heralds the new discoveries, is not “Eureka!” (I found it!), but “That’s funny…” – Isaac Asimov
The only reason God did not put "Thou shalt mind thine own business" in the Ten Commandments was that He thought that it was too obvious to need stating. - Kenberg
2

#4 User is offline   Zelandakh 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 10,666
  • Joined: 2006-May-18
  • Gender:Not Telling

Posted 2016-July-18, 08:04

These types of hands come up often on Master Solver panels and they tend to show a clear sea-change in bidding philosophy. As a general rule, all of the younger panel members along with those that are still playing at the top level will tend to prefer the call that gets them to the best strain even if that might well put them a level higher than they would like to be. It is not so much that bidding game is clear so much as the strain issue. If we had to bid a major directly, I daresay most would prefer 3 to 4. However 4 offers a little of both and is what I would expect to be the majority choice.
(-: Zel :-)

Happy New Year everyone!
0

#5 User is offline   billw55 

  • enigmatic
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 4,757
  • Joined: 2009-July-31
  • Gender:Male

Posted 2016-July-18, 08:08

The SJ Simon rule points to 4. Against that, opener is behind my partner. In deals with two strong hands, this positional advantage is often large.

In general when I am uncertain, I prefer to lose by overbidding than by underbidding. So 4.

But yes I think it is close.
Life is long and beautiful, if bad things happen, good things will follow.
-gwnn
0

#6 User is offline   MrAce 

  • VIP Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 6,971
  • Joined: 2009-November-14
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Houston, TX

Posted 2016-July-18, 08:26

3
"Genius has its own limitations, however stupidity has no such boundaries!"
"It's only when a mosquito lands on your testicles that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence!"

"Well to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion, of course without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter in a different perspective and without being condemning of one's view's and by trying to make it objectified, and by considering each and every one's valid opinion, I honestly believe that I completely forgot what I was going to say."





0

#7 User is offline   MrAce 

  • VIP Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 6,971
  • Joined: 2009-November-14
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Houston, TX

Posted 2016-July-18, 08:26

3
"Genius has its own limitations, however stupidity has no such boundaries!"
"It's only when a mosquito lands on your testicles that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence!"

"Well to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion, of course without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter in a different perspective and without being condemning of one's view's and by trying to make it objectified, and by considering each and every one's valid opinion, I honestly believe that I completely forgot what I was going to say."





0

#8 User is offline   Trinidad 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 4,531
  • Joined: 2005-October-09
  • Location:Netherlands

Posted 2016-July-18, 09:43

View PostMrAce, on 2016-July-18, 08:26, said:

3

View PostMrAce, on 2016-July-18, 08:26, said:

3

I think 6 is somewhat of an overbid. :P

Rik
I want my opponents to leave my table with a smile on their face and without matchpoints on their score card - in that order.
The most exciting phrase to hear in science, the one that heralds the new discoveries, is not “Eureka!” (I found it!), but “That’s funny…” – Isaac Asimov
The only reason God did not put "Thou shalt mind thine own business" in the Ten Commandments was that He thought that it was too obvious to need stating. - Kenberg
1

#9 User is offline   kuhchung 

  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Full Members
  • Posts: 729
  • Joined: 2010-August-03

Posted 2016-July-18, 10:38

I thought 4D was clear

i guess the concern is partner has the big balanced hand and 4D drives us too far, whereas we can go 3S 4H since we just expect partner to go again
Videos of the worst bridge player ever playing bridge:
https://www.youtube....hungPlaysBridge
0

#10 User is offline   MrAce 

  • VIP Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 6,971
  • Joined: 2009-November-14
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Houston, TX

Posted 2016-July-18, 10:55

View PostTrinidad, on 2016-July-18, 09:43, said:

I think 6 is somewhat of an overbid. :P

Rik


Yea I know, my mouse has double click issues.
"Genius has its own limitations, however stupidity has no such boundaries!"
"It's only when a mosquito lands on your testicles that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence!"

"Well to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion, of course without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter in a different perspective and without being condemning of one's view's and by trying to make it objectified, and by considering each and every one's valid opinion, I honestly believe that I completely forgot what I was going to say."





0

#11 User is offline   rmnka447 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 2,366
  • Joined: 2012-March-18
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Illinois
  • Interests:Bridge, Golf, Soccer

Posted 2016-July-18, 14:48

I'm an old geezer, so 3 for me.
0

#12 User is offline   Winstonm 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 17,190
  • Joined: 2005-January-08
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Tulsa, Oklahoma
  • Interests:Art, music

Posted 2016-July-18, 15:14

I think 3S puts too much pressure on partner to find a winning call - after all, you may have bid 3S on a hand with much less playing strength. I think 4D overstates the hand so I'm left with either 4H or 4S. I chose 4S.
"Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." Black Lives Matter. / "I need ammunition, not a ride." Zelensky
0

#13 User is offline   jogs 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 1,316
  • Joined: 2011-March-01
  • Gender:Male
  • Interests:student of the game

Posted 2016-July-18, 15:29

This hand only has 3 HCP. Only 1 diamond. Partner is likely to have 2 or fewer diamonds.
Whether we bid 3 or 4, LHO is likely to rebid 5. They do have half the deck and 10 to 12 diamonds.
Fear after 4, partner would expect this hand to be stronger.
0

#14 User is offline   wank 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 2,866
  • Joined: 2008-July-13

Posted 2016-July-18, 16:01

i also think it's pretty clear to bid 4d
0

#15 User is offline   ggwhiz 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 3,952
  • Joined: 2008-June-23
  • Gender:Male

Posted 2016-July-18, 16:15

I'm sold on 4

That said I have casual partners where this bid is unsafe as they will definitely bid to the moon.
When a deaf person goes to court is it still called a hearing?
What is baby oil made of?
0

#16 User is offline   nige1 

  • 5-level belongs to me
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 9,128
  • Joined: 2004-August-30
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Glasgow Scotland
  • Interests:Poems Computers

Posted 2016-July-18, 17:45

View Posteagles123, on 2016-July-18, 06:39, said:


3d = preempt
imps
Spoiler
I rank
  • 4 UCB but it requires that the partnership rate getting to the right marginal game as more important than partscore or or slam. If you cue-bid with weak shapely hands, partner must be wary of slam-tries.
  • 3 NF and should not over-excite partner,

0

#17 User is offline   mike777 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 16,739
  • Joined: 2003-October-07
  • Gender:Male

Posted 2016-July-18, 22:55

3s seems clear how much worse could I be.
0

#18 User is offline   wank 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 2,866
  • Joined: 2008-July-13

Posted 2016-July-18, 22:57

View Postmike777, on 2016-July-18, 22:55, said:

3s seems clear how much worse could I be.


2 hearts, 1 spade and the king

if we're not making game, the opps are probably making something
0

#19 User is offline   mike777 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 16,739
  • Joined: 2003-October-07
  • Gender:Male

Posted 2016-July-18, 22:58

View Postwank, on 2016-July-18, 22:57, said:

2 hearts, 1 spade and the king



Be not afraid...dont play partner for perfect cards
Dont play partner for worst cards.Not sure how you play partner for only 3 major suit cards on this auction but ok.
0

#20 User is offline   Trinidad 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 4,531
  • Joined: 2005-October-09
  • Location:Netherlands

Posted 2016-July-19, 00:50

View Postmike777, on 2016-July-18, 22:55, said:

3s seems clear how much worse could I be.

You could have 4 losers more than you have and a misfit for partner. That is a lot worse than what you have.

Rik
I want my opponents to leave my table with a smile on their face and without matchpoints on their score card - in that order.
The most exciting phrase to hear in science, the one that heralds the new discoveries, is not “Eureka!” (I found it!), but “That’s funny…” – Isaac Asimov
The only reason God did not put "Thou shalt mind thine own business" in the Ten Commandments was that He thought that it was too obvious to need stating. - Kenberg
0

  • 3 Pages +
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • You cannot start a new topic
  • You cannot reply to this topic

2 User(s) are reading this topic
0 members, 2 guests, 0 anonymous users