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5 over 5 with void in their suit?

#1 User is offline   mgoetze 

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Posted 2015-July-26, 10:48



6-board team matches, IMPs converted to VPs.
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#2 User is offline   Phil 

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Posted 2015-July-26, 11:28

I think we should have bid 4 to set up a forcing pass and involve partner.

If partner has a diamond card I want to defend. Even if partner doesn't have a diamond card, 5 isn't certain.

If I have to guess after 4, I'll double.
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#3 User is offline   ggwhiz 

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Posted 2015-July-26, 12:02

View PostPhil, on 2015-July-26, 11:28, said:

I think we should have bid 4 to set up a forcing pass and involve partner.

If partner has a diamond card I want to defend. Even if partner doesn't have a diamond card, 5 isn't certain.

If I have to guess after 4, I'll double.


Yes and with a possible bonus of hearts being a better contract or inhibiting the lead.
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#4 User is offline   Phil 

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Posted 2015-July-26, 13:38

View Postggwhiz, on 2015-July-26, 12:02, said:

Yes and with a possible bonus of hearts being a better contract or inhibiting the lead.


Since its the only call under 4, it really isn't related to hearts.
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#5 User is offline   karlson 

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Posted 2015-July-26, 13:54

I would double. Could work out badly.
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#6 User is offline   cherdano 

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Posted 2015-July-26, 17:02

I'd double, but pass is fine to.
Bidding 5 doesn't look like an option.
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#7 User is offline   nige1 

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Posted 2015-July-26, 17:49

View Postmgoetze, on 2015-July-26, 10:48, said:


6-board team matches, IMPs converted to VPs.
I rank
  • Double. Extras. 5 is unlikely to make. Anyway, you shouldn't let it play undoubled.
  • 5. I expect this to make more often than not.
  • Pass. Timorous. Partner might bid 5 but is unlikely to double.




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#8 User is offline   steve2005 

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Posted 2015-July-26, 19:01

View Postnige1, on 2015-July-26, 17:49, said:

I rank
  • Double. Extras. 5 is unlikely to make. Anyway, you shouldn't let it play undoubled.
  • 5. I expect this to make more often than not.
  • Pass. Timorous. Partner might bid 5 but is unlikely to double.

I agree with rankings but pass is out of question unless u had bid 4 (not necessarily hearts) to let p know u have really good hand Otherwise p can't make intelligent choice.
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#9 User is offline   phil_20686 

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Posted 2015-July-29, 09:45

You have to double now. 5S just doesn't feel right at all. I would have bid 4H over 4d. Not only as a competitive but because partner might have a chance to make a slam try now when he is bidding 5S. If he has something like Axxx Kx xxxx xxx or xxxx AKx xxx xxx then he can bid 5H over 5D to show he has a maximum with all working points.
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#10 User is offline   cherdano 

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Posted 2015-July-29, 10:21

So, 4 by us is artificial, but 5 by partner is showing something in hearts? Are we sure we aren't influenced by our hand when we think so?

To me, bidding 4, then doubling 5 is the best sequence with this hand. As for 4, I am not convinced "setting up a forcing pass, but completely unrelated to hearts" is the best way to use this bid. It may well be better to play it as "I have hearts and am interested in competing to 5 over their 5", and have no way of showing the same message with clubs. Even a generic slam try might be better.

What use is setting up a forcing pass when partner has no idea what our hand is? With the actual hand, we are ok bidding 4 then doubling 5; and if we have a 2-suiter, making a forcing pass with completely unspecified side suit won't help partner at all.
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