[eagles123]

All red at imps it goes p p 1n (15/17) p

J752
A3
Q98432
2

What is best here?

Eagles

[broze]

I would bid 2C - then raise 2S to 4, pass 2D and rebid 2N if p bids 2H accepting that we may get too high. Of course this kind of depends on what 1n-2c-2h-2s means.

[jbaptistec]

Hand is a bit too strong for a ♦ transfer followed by pass, and too weak to force game.

I would try 2♣.

• Over 2♦ -> pass
  
• Over 2♥ (unlucky) -> invite in NT (since 3♦ would force game)
  
• Over 2♠ -> 4♠

[mike777]

I will ignore spades and show a weakish hand with long D. Pard will note I did not open a weak 2d so for me:

p=1nt
2s=2nt or 3c
3d(wk)=

2s asks for a 4 card minor, if pard shows 4d I can get excited.
2nt=deny 4 card minor.

[WesleyC]

I'm happy to start with simple stayman planning to pass over 2D, 2S over 2H and 4S over 2S.

The only sequence i'm slightly unhappy about is passing 2D, because if partner has some diamond values and sharp cards we might miss a cold game eg: [Qxx Kxx KJx AKxx] or [Ax Qxx AKx Kxxxx].

Unfortunately, you can't catch these hands AND explore for a spade fit without special methods.

[jerdonald]

BBO forum,

We play a convention called "The Gap" to handle hands like this.
2 spades is a transfer to 6+ clubs and 2NT is a transfer to 6+
diamonds.

With this hand I would bid 2NT which starts off as a transfer to
diamomds but if the 1N opener has at least 3 diamonds including
the Ace or King he bids 3 clubs instead of diamomds. Now I have
the option of shutting off the bidding at 3 diamonds or go on to 3NT.

Clubs work similar except 2S starts the transfer to clubs and if
the 1N opener has at least 3 clubs including the Ace or King he
bids 2N instead of clubs. Now I have the option of shutting off
the bidding at 3 clubs or go on to 3NT.

To get to 2NT over a 1NT opener responder bids 2 clubs(seems to
be Stayman) and bids 2NT over whatever the opener bids and opener
passes. At this point opener must alert that "responder may or
may not have a 4 card major".

Rarely comes up but works.

Jerry D.

[Vampyr]

jerdonald, on 2015-March-22, 19:18, said:

With this hand I would bid 2NT which starts off as a transfer to
diamomds but if the 1N opener has at least 3 diamonds including
the Ace or King he bids 3 clubs instead of diamomds. Now I have
the option of shutting off the bidding at 3 diamonds or go on to 3NT.

Clubs work similar except 2S starts the transfer to clubs and if
the 1N opener has at least 3 clubs including the Ace or King he
bids 2N instead of clubs. Now I have the option of shutting off
the bidding at 3 clubs or go on to 3NT.

The reverse is theoretically better and I think more popular now as well. It enables you to find your probable best fit when weak with 5-5 in the majors.

Quote

To get to 2NT over a 1NT opener responder bids 2 clubs(seems to
be Stayman) and bids 2NT over whatever the opener bids and opener
passes.

Well. Passes or bids game.

Quote

At this point opener must alert At this point opener must alert that "responder may or
may not have a 4 card

Note that the OP is in the UK where this alert does not apply.

[neilkaz]

@ jerdonald...

When I learned your convention almost 30 years ago it was called 4 suit Transfers with Pre-Acceptance.

I think the current ACBL rule is that you no longer have to alert whether responder may or may not have a 4 card major?

[BillPatch]

neilkaz, on 2015-March-22, 19:46, said:

....

I think the current ACBL rule is that you no longer have to alert whether responder may or may not have a 4 card major?

Correct.

[blackshoe]

BillPatch, on 2015-March-23, 03:48, said:

Correct.

Oh? When did that happen? The Alert Chart on the ACBL website still says it requires an alert. OTOH, it's dated 2011, and effective 1 Jan 2012.

[gordontd]

eagles123, on 2015-March-22, 11:34, said:

All red at imps it goes p p 1n (15/17) p

J752
A3
Q98432
2

What is best here?

Eagles

I like to play that Stayman followed by 3m is invitational, when playing a strong NT, for hand's like this. When playing a weak NT I like to play it as weak, also for hands like this.

[gszes]

This is IMPS = BIG bonus for making game. If we can hit p with 4 spades it does not take much to make game there so lets start with stayman and see if there is a 44 major suit fit. So what do we do if p bids 2d or 2h? There are many approaches but there is one single reason to just blast 3n. 5d just seems too far away. There are only a tiny amount of hands p can have where 5d has reasonable play. 3N has a much greater potential to make and interestingly enough most hands that make 3n will not make 5d and vice versa:)

IF you have a set of agreements that will allow you to search for 3n in comfort then go for it. There is another benefit to blasting 3n the opps will not know you have a long dia suit and may not make a dramatic lead giving your side time. If you search for 3n and end up there the defense is much more likely to be accurate.

[wank]

i was given the hand already. unless you can check for spades and bail to 3m, i'd just settle for playing a diamond partscore.

you started turning up for these u25 things then?

[eagles123]

wank, on 2015-March-23, 08:23, said:

i was given the hand already. unless you can check for spades and bail to 3m, i'd just settle for playing a diamond partscore.

you started turning up for these u25 things then?

Yeah lol

[aguahombre]

blackshoe, on 2015-March-23, 07:19, said:

Oh? When did that happen? The Alert Chart on the ACBL website still says it requires an alert. OTOH, it's dated 2011, and effective 1 Jan 2012.

I believe the others are confusing two issues.

At the time we bid 2C, it is not alerted. But when the person who bid 2C rebids 2NT, opener alerts at that time if it might or might not have a four major.

1N-2C
2D-2N..2nt alerted -- might not hold a major.

1N-2C
2S-2N..2nt alerted -- unknown if responder has hearts.

1N-2C
2H-2N..2nt alerted (in our case) denies holding 4 spades.

[Zelandakh]

aguahombre, on 2015-March-23, 09:30, said:

I believe the others are confusing two issues.

I believe a single issue is being confused - the OP plays in England so ACBL alerting regs are completely irrelevant to this thread.

[Vampyr]

Zelandakh, on 2015-March-23, 09:50, said:

I believe a single issue is being confused - the OP plays in England so ACBL alerting regs are completely irrelevant to this thread.

Yes, and this whole discussion seems to have started after I pointed out that fact above.

But it would be unnatural for a thread to be bereft of comments about ACBL alert/system regulations!

[aguahombre]

Vampyr, on 2015-March-23, 10:27, said:

Yes, and this whole discussion seems to have started after I pointed out that fact above.

But it would be unnatural for a thread to be bereft of comments about ACBL alert/system regulations!

I do not think it hurts to mention for the benefit of readers from various jurisdictions that even though the OP is located in one place, the rules would be different in another.

[Zelandakh]

When the question is from an EBUer asking "what is the best bid/approach?" it seems to me something akin to threadjacking to start (yet) another discussion about ACBL alert regs within the thread, at least until after the main discussion from the OP has died away.

[aguahombre]

Zelandakh, on 2015-March-23, 10:45, said:

When the question is from an EBUer asking "what is the best bid/approach?" it seems to me something akin to threadjacking to start (yet) another discussion about ACBL alert regs within the thread, at least until after the main discussion from the OP has died away.

And what is the appropriate length of time before trying to correct one of those hijacks which misstates the rules of a particular jurisdiction?

I agree that it was a threadjack to bring in ACBL regulations which are irrelevant to EBU and to the OP. That is a disservice to the OP. But leaving misinformation uncorrected is a disservice to the casual reader; so, it is a dilemma IMO.