[bob1509]

You hold ♠ A3 ♥ 4 ♦ AQJ9752 ♣ KJ4 first in at teams green against red.
You open 1D, LHO bids 1S and partner bids 2H to you. What do you bid?

[akwoo]

I bid 2♠, asking partner to bid no trump with a stopper and find the most descriptive bid without. (Partner could have a serious problem with 3523 and no stopper but should be fine otherwise.)

[mgoetze]

Was 2♥ forcing? Do you have an agreement what 2♠ means now?

[bob1509]

Partner's 2♥ is forcing. 2 ♠ shows a good ♥ raise and 3♠ a stop ask for 3nt.

[mike777]

2s as UCB if allowed.(general force, tell me more)

over 2nt response will bid a forcing 3d
over 3h response will bid 4d.

[mr1303]

I presume 3D is not forcing here?

If not, I follow the pathway that allows me to bid a forcing 3D. I don't want to bid 3S here followed by 3D. Apart from anything else, shouldn't 3S be a splinter?

If I don't have a way to bid 3D forcing, I bid 3NT and tell partner I need a way to rebid my suit below 3NT and have it forcing.

[rmnka447]

I'm bidding 2 ♠ which shows a good hand with or without ♥ support.

You have only 15 HCP, but have an excellent 7 card ♦ suit. It is a 5 loser hand which is a bit better playing strength than a lot of 16-18 point hands which you would jump rebid in ♦. There's no reason not to let that you have a strong hand.

[Zelandakh]

bob1509, on 2015-February-18, 20:58, said:

Partner's 2♥ is forcing. 2 ♠ shows a good ♥ raise and 3♠ a stop ask for 3nt.

This is not a bidding problem so much as a system problem. These agreements are basically unworkable and will often lead to problems such as this.

[helene_t]

The useful space principle says that the stopper ask needs more space than the strong raise. if p does not have a stopper we still need to negotiate the strain. P might have six hearts and a stopper. We might even want to ask for a stopper without gf strength. Or, as here, with a stopper ourselves.

So 2s is just any hand that can't bid anything else and we can use 3s as the strong raise.

[Cyberyeti]

For me, 2N is unambiguously forcing (and not necessarily balanced) so I don't have an issue here.

With the OP's agreements I think I bid 3♣ intending to bid 3♠ over 3red assuming 2N is NF.

[helene_t]

If 2n is forcing what do you bid with kqxx-x-ajxxx-jxx ?

[Cyberyeti]

helene_t, on 2015-February-19, 07:40, said:

If 2n is forcing what do you bid with kqxx-x-ajxxx-jxx ?

I have to hold my nose and bid 3♦, the advantages of this approach come when I don't have to do this, reverse the honours in spades and clubs and I might bid 3♣ not showing extras and limited by the failure to bid 2N.

Clearly you can only do this in a weak NT context, as otherwise what do you do with a 4243 12 count ?

[helene_t]

Well in a weak nt system I either bid 2NT with the hand I showed, or I play NFB in which case my hand is a pass.

Playing strong NT I rebid a nonforcing 2NT with the weak balanced hand as well as with the balanced hand, and use 2♠ with the awkward strong hands (including those that would like to make a forcing 3♦ bid) but also with those that would like to make a nonforcing 3♣ bid. But maybe 2♠ should be reserved for strong hands so 3♣ is nonforcing? I am not even sure what is standard, help!

If 2NT is a generic strong hand, then presumably 2♠ is a generic weak hand?

[Fluffy]

There was a topic a couple of years ago on expert forum, I think the consensous was that 2NT not only was nonforcing, it didn't even require a stopper since you will be stuck with 12-14 balanced otherwise.

[gordontd]

I'd bid 3NT because that seems to me the most likely game, and I want to protect partner's ♠Qx or Jxx. Of course if I could bid a forcing 3♦ I'd prefer that.

[Cyberyeti]

helene_t, on 2015-February-19, 08:27, said:

If 2NT is a generic strong hand, then presumably 2♠ is a generic weak hand?

No it's a heart raise F3♥ for us.

[lamford]

gordontd, on 2015-February-19, 08:53, said:

I'd bid 3NT because that seems to me the most likely game, and I want to protect partner's ♠Qx or Jxx. Of course if I could bid a forcing 3♦ I'd prefer that.

I was about to suggest 3NT myself and to say that partner is quite likely to have a spade card as there has been no raise. I am surprised that someone called Bob did not choose it!

[mike777]

hate to give up on slam so soon, pard needs just a little.