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A 13 IMP swing. Game vs partscore BBF vs JEC Jan 24, bd 18

#1 User is offline   diana_eva 

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Posted 2015-February-04, 02:43

Got fried on this one, when our table was allowed to play 2 while the other table bid and made 3NT.

Anything we could have done differently?


This post has been edited by diana_eva: 2015-February-04, 03:05


#2 User is offline   scarletv 

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Posted 2015-February-04, 03:00

View Postdiana_eva, on 2015-February-04, 02:43, said:



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#3 User is offline   diana_eva 

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Posted 2015-February-04, 03:06

Thanks Scarlet. My net failed while I was posting the diagram :(

Fixed OP now.

#4 User is offline   phoenix214 

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Posted 2015-February-04, 03:26

Do not know what system are they playing, but should ask about the meaning of the 2 bid a bit more. I know that me and my pard play it like in Ambra(2 = raise to 2 or GF with diamonds). They should have it somewhere along the same lines as well.

If that is the case S might decide to bid something on the second round, 2NT or 3. Of course this runs the risk of going down for a number, if W has a strong hand, but that is a risk you have to take. Also note that N most likely has a spade stack so even if he has points, he will not find a bid.
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#5 User is offline   ahydra 

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Posted 2015-February-04, 05:51

I think South just about has enough for a prebalance 3D after 2S.

ahydra
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#6 User is offline   ArtK78 

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Posted 2015-February-04, 06:23

I would not bid on the South hand. RHO has an opening bid and LHO has enough to respond, so game is unlikely. If it is right to prebalance, it is a part score battle, and the likely upside is 6 IMPs. But if you are wrong, you could go for a number opposite air. Having not acted on the first round, I would not do so now.
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#7 User is offline   cherdano 

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Posted 2015-February-04, 06:48

I bid 2 on the first round, and I feel very strongly about this. You can't pass with this much playing strength.
Obviously we have a recall bias in favour of the assholes. -helene_t
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#8 User is offline   ArtK78 

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Posted 2015-February-04, 09:21

View Postcherdano, on 2015-February-04, 06:48, said:

I bid 2 on the first round, and I feel very strongly about this. You can't pass with this much playing strength.

Bidding on the first round certainly makes more sense than passing on the first round and bidding on the second round.
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#9 User is offline   diana_eva 

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Posted 2015-February-04, 09:34

View Postphoenix214, on 2015-February-04, 03:26, said:

Do not know what system are they playing, but should ask about the meaning of the 2 bid a bit more. I know that me and my pard play it like in Ambra(2 = raise to 2 or GF with diamonds). They should have it somewhere along the same lines as well.

If that is the case S might decide to bid something on the second round, 2NT or 3. Of course this runs the risk of going down for a number, if W has a strong hand, but that is a risk you have to take. Also note that N most likely has a spade stack so even if he has points, he will not find a bid.


They were playing some strong club system. I didn't think to ask whether 1 was limited, nor to ask them to elaborate on 2. I was very tempted to bid 1st time, then once I decided not to, I continued to pass. I can see how my pd had nothing to say on that sequence, so this one was on me. Dunno if we'd reach game unless I bid first time. Ah well...

#10 User is offline   NickRW 

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Posted 2015-February-04, 10:38

Think I agree with 2 at the first opportunity.

It maybe gets to be a more interesting problem if the diamonds are weaker and the clubs a little stronger, say:

x
xx
A97xxx
AJ98

I must admit I am starting to get chicken livered then.
"Pass is your friend" - my brother in law - who likes to bid a lot.
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#11 User is offline   P_Marlowe 

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Posted 2015-February-04, 11:53

Hi,

#1 2D direct is an option, but Pass is certainly not wrong, it would be clear,
if partner would have been dealer, but with the given position I dont think either decision is 100%

#2 Given the colors, a prebal. is also dangerous, to put it mildly.
I am sure the xfer can contain inv.+ values and since they play a limited system.

In short: If you always keep your 2 level overcalls up to strength, this is just bad luck.

With kind regards
Marlowe
With kind regards
Uwe Gebhardt (P_Marlowe)
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#12 User is offline   PhantomSac 

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Posted 2015-February-04, 15:20

The south hand is not a light overcall, it's a normal one. I think it is bad hand evaluation to think that it is "not up to strength", it has aces, a pretty good suit, 6-4 shape, even the right singleton. It is the kind of hand you are thrilled if your partner bids 3N with, you're happy if he competes in diamonds, you're happy if he doubles them, you're even happy if he makes some kind of responsive double. You are not happy to pass throughout, stuff like this happens.
The artist formerly known as jlall
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#13 User is offline   diana_eva 

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Posted 2015-February-05, 03:49

View PostPhantomSac, on 2015-February-04, 15:20, said:

The south hand is not a light overcall, it's a normal one. I think it is bad hand evaluation to think that it is "not up to strength", it has aces, a pretty good suit, 6-4 shape, even the right singleton. It is the kind of hand you are thrilled if your partner bids 3N with, you're happy if he competes in diamonds, you're happy if he doubles them, you're even happy if he makes some kind of responsive double. You are not happy to pass throughout, stuff like this happens.


OK. I guess I'm still a bean counter. I thought it would be a light overcall and chickened out given the vul and unknown partner.

Thanks all for the replies, very helpful.

#14 User is offline   PhilKing 

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Posted 2015-February-05, 03:54

This hand is a good example of the advantage of not playing weak jump overcalls at red - by playing 3 as a hand that would open 1 and rebid Three, partner will give you more leeway when you overcall 2. The real truth is that, even before I had changed to the agreement above, I had become too scared a make a weak jump at red more than about twice a year.

Anyway, I would overcall 2 regardless of system.
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#15 User is offline   fourdad 

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Posted 2015-February-05, 05:27

Immediate 2 overcall is a good place to start.
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#16 User is offline   GrahamJson 

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Posted 2015-February-05, 08:20

Looks like a routine 2D over all to me too.
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#17 User is offline   GrahamJson 

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Posted 2015-February-05, 08:21

Damn those autocorrects. Overcall not over all.
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#18 User is offline   dbl118 

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Posted 2015-February-05, 19:03

I would bid 2d.

It's worth noting that 3nt by South has a decent chance to go down, depending on the auction.
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#19 User is offline   Sagitt 

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Posted 2015-February-06, 08:00

Although it could be overcalled with 2 in the beginning, it is very necessary to ask what the 2 bid is..If it is a real suit I would double to show the other suits and then my partner can decide what to do. The silence after the 1 bid can be compensated this way. But my way is to overcall as 2 then to bid 3 if possible..
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#20 User is offline   gszes 

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Posted 2015-February-07, 13:58

x xx KQ9xxx KJxx I would not overcall 2d
x xx AJ9xxx Axxx I would overcall 2d the difference to me is the two quick tricks
in case the bidding becomes confrontational. I would not chicken out if I held
x xx Axxxxx AJ9x:) The aces make a monstrous difference when p has to make game
decisions and the opps lacking those aces will find it more difficult to penalty x
us.
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