BBO Discussion Forums: Double Response - BBO Discussion Forums

Jump to content

Page 1 of 1
  • You cannot start a new topic
  • You cannot reply to this topic

Double Response

#1 User is offline   eagles123 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 1,831
  • Joined: 2011-June-08
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:UK Near London
  • Interests:Crystal Palace

Posted 2015-January-29, 14:31



what sort of hand are you expecting for West here?

MP if it matters

many thanks

Eagles
"definitely that's what I like to play when I'm playing standard - I want to be able to bid diamonds because bidding good suits is important in bridge" - Meckstroth's opinion on weak 2 diamond
0

#2 User is offline   whereagles 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 14,900
  • Joined: 2004-May-11
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Portugal
  • Interests:Everything!

Posted 2015-January-29, 14:31

4H, 5C
0

#3 User is offline   Fluffy 

  • World International Master without a clue
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 17,404
  • Joined: 2003-November-13
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:madrid

Posted 2015-January-29, 14:52

4 and 4+ about 6-8
4

#4 User is offline   eagles123 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 1,831
  • Joined: 2011-June-08
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:UK Near London
  • Interests:Crystal Palace

Posted 2015-January-29, 16:30

well i had

Jxx
AQxx
x
Txxxx

p drove it to 4h because "we have a double fit"

Tx
xxx
AKxx
AKTx

oops
"definitely that's what I like to play when I'm playing standard - I want to be able to bid diamonds because bidding good suits is important in bridge" - Meckstroth's opinion on weak 2 diamond
0

#5 User is offline   wank 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 2,866
  • Joined: 2008-July-13

Posted 2015-January-29, 17:33

if you had 5 hearts you would just bid hearts again.
2

#6 User is offline   eagles123 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 1,831
  • Joined: 2011-June-08
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:UK Near London
  • Interests:Crystal Palace

Posted 2015-January-29, 18:04

View Postwank, on 2015-January-29, 17:33, said:

if you had 5 hearts you would just bid hearts again.


tell that to my partner lol although she was just a random pickup
"definitely that's what I like to play when I'm playing standard - I want to be able to bid diamonds because bidding good suits is important in bridge" - Meckstroth's opinion on weak 2 diamond
0

#7 User is offline   Phil 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 10,092
  • Joined: 2008-December-11
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:North Texas, USA
  • Interests:Mountain Biking

Posted 2015-January-29, 18:14

This definitely shows equal/longer clubs and only four hearts.
Hi y'all!

Winner - BBO Challenge bracket #6 - February, 2017.
3

#8 User is offline   johnu 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 4,833
  • Joined: 2008-September-10
  • Gender:Male

Posted 2015-January-29, 20:33

View Posteagles123, on 2015-January-29, 16:30, said:

well i had

Jxx
AQxx
xx
Txxxx




I'm guessing you didn't actually have that hand :P
0

#9 User is offline   steve2005 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 3,148
  • Joined: 2010-April-22
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Hamilton, Canada
  • Interests:Bridge duh!

Posted 2015-January-29, 20:58

View PostFluffy, on 2015-January-29, 14:52, said:

4 and 4+ about 6-8

give the guy a break he could have real crap at MP NV. With INV strength will do something else.
Sarcasm is a state of mind
0

#10 User is offline   rmnka447 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 2,366
  • Joined: 2012-March-18
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Illinois
  • Interests:Bridge, Golf, Soccer

Posted 2015-January-29, 22:43

View PostFluffy, on 2015-January-29, 14:52, said:

4 and 4+ about 6-8

I agree with Fluffy.

When responding to a TOX with a minimum hand, it's often better to bid the higher ranking suit first so that you can rebid in the lower ranking suit and let partner still have a chance to preference between the suits without raising the level of the contract. That's especially so here where you 're already forced to bid at the 2 level. If advancer bids 2 initially, then the suit will be lost if opener rebids 2 . Advancer's hand is just not good enough to introduce s at the 3 level.

A second call by advancer should indicate top of range if 4-4 or 5-4. It could also be slightly less if very shapely 5-5 or better. With 5 s, advancer would simply rebid s as doubler guarantees at least 3.

Doubler does have a great 14, but it's still a 7 loser hand, so I'm passing 3 .
0

#11 User is offline   whereagles 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 14,900
  • Joined: 2004-May-11
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Portugal
  • Interests:Everything!

Posted 2015-January-30, 05:17

Terrible standards of pick up pards these days.. Posted Image
0

#12 User is offline   MrAce 

  • VIP Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 6,971
  • Joined: 2009-November-14
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Houston, TX

Posted 2015-January-30, 07:39

I know it is fashion on BBF to say "I call TD" or "I am guessing you actually did not have this hand" or similar humorous ways, but you have 14 cards brother.
"Genius has its own limitations, however stupidity has no such boundaries!"
"It's only when a mosquito lands on your testicles that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence!"

"Well to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion, of course without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter in a different perspective and without being condemning of one's view's and by trying to make it objectified, and by considering each and every one's valid opinion, I honestly believe that I completely forgot what I was going to say."





0

#13 User is offline   eagles123 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 1,831
  • Joined: 2011-June-08
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:UK Near London
  • Interests:Crystal Palace

Posted 2015-January-30, 07:43

sorry yes it was stiff diamond - edited
"definitely that's what I like to play when I'm playing standard - I want to be able to bid diamonds because bidding good suits is important in bridge" - Meckstroth's opinion on weak 2 diamond
0

#14 User is offline   ahydra 

  • AQT92 AQ --- QJ6532
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 2,840
  • Joined: 2009-September-09
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Wellington, NZ

Posted 2015-January-30, 08:09

View Postrmnka447, on 2015-January-29, 22:43, said:

When responding to a TOX with a minimum hand, it's often better to bid the higher ranking suit first so that you can rebid in the lower ranking suit


With a minimum response to a TOX, say a 2-count, you would just bid once (as forced) and then shut up, surely. I'm guessing you're including all non-jump/1NT/2S-responses in "minimum", whereas this hand isn't really a minimum; it's right at the top strength-wise for a simple response, and has shape to boot.

I'm not convinced that this sequence necessarily has to deny 5 hearts - if you had x Kxxxx xx Q10xxx would you not bid 2H then 3C?

The rest of rmnka's post is spot on though, particularly the point that doubler should not be bidding anything else - there's no way the partnership has enough for game. 4H sounds like the kind of bid GIB likes to make.

ahydra
0

#15 User is offline   rmnka447 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 2,366
  • Joined: 2012-March-18
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Illinois
  • Interests:Bridge, Golf, Soccer

Posted 2015-January-30, 14:02

View Postahydra, on 2015-January-30, 08:09, said:

With a minimum response to a TOX, say a 2-count, you would just bid once (as forced) and then shut up, surely. I'm guessing you're including all non-jump/1NT/2S-responses in "minimum", whereas this hand isn't really a minimum; it's right at the top strength-wise for a simple response, and has shape to boot.

I'm not convinced that this sequence necessarily has to deny 5 hearts - if you had x Kxxxx xx Q10xxx would you not bid 2H then 3C?

The rest of rmnka's post is spot on though, particularly the point that doubler should not be bidding anything else - there's no way the partnership has enough for game. 4H sounds like the kind of bid GIB likes to make.

ahydra

Yes, you normally make one bid with a bad hand. But bidding the higher suit is preparing for the possibility that you might forced to bid again.

Say, for instance, in this auction that partner doubled again over 2 showing extras while you held the given hand albeit with only 2 points. Now you can 3 and let partner decide where to play. In this revised case, Partner's hand might be something like x AKx K6543 AJxx where partner elected to make a TOX rather than make a 2 level overcall on a terrible holding.
2

#16 User is offline   fourdad 

  • PipPipPipPip
  • Group: Full Members
  • Posts: 268
  • Joined: 2013-March-08
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:South Florida
  • Interests:Bridge, Football, Coaching, Family, Writing

Posted 2015-January-31, 06:22

A TOX misdescribes the sahpe of the hand. Strictly speaking the hand promises 4H's.
I would not X and wait to balance or defend, deciding that later in the auction.

2S is down 1 and a balance can likely drive opps higher.
0

#17 User is offline   Jinksy 

  • Experimental biddicist
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 1,907
  • Joined: 2010-January-02
  • Gender:Male

Posted 2015-January-31, 07:08

View Postfourdad, on 2015-January-31, 06:22, said:

A TOX misdescribes the sahpe of the hand. Strictly speaking the hand promises 4H's.
I would not X and wait to balance or defend, deciding that later in the auction.


A TOX just promises that you can handle a heart response from P. That can be based on shape, significant extra strength, or something in between. I'd prefer an honour in my tripleton, but this still looks like a clear X to me.
The "4 is a transfer to 4" award goes to Jinksy - PhilKing
0

#18 User is offline   AyunuS 

  • PipPipPipPip
  • Group: Full Members
  • Posts: 284
  • Joined: 2011-December-15

Posted 2015-January-31, 11:52

I would expect 5+, 4+, longer clubs than hearts, otherwise he would have bid hearts first, and 6-10 HCP. With 11+ HCP and that distribution he would have had to bid 2 on the first response, and with fewer than 6, he wouldn't have bid again.
0

#19 User is offline   wank 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 2,866
  • Joined: 2008-July-13

Posted 2015-January-31, 12:46

View Postfourdad, on 2015-January-31, 06:22, said:

A TOX misdescribes the sahpe of the hand. Strictly speaking the hand promises 4H's.



you are very wrong. i suggest you read a book as this is quite basic.
1

#20 User is offline   iandayre 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 1,114
  • Joined: 2013-December-23
  • Gender:Male

Posted 2015-January-31, 13:31

View Postwank, on 2015-January-31, 12:46, said:

you are very wrong. i suggest you read a book as this is quite basic.



I'm glad you're here Wank. You say things the way I think them, though I've learned to be a bit diplomatic over the years.
0

Page 1 of 1
  • You cannot start a new topic
  • You cannot reply to this topic

1 User(s) are reading this topic
0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users