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Starting at the 4 level... A strong hand

#1 User is offline   mgoetze 

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Posted 2015-January-03, 10:44


What's your plan?
"One of the painful things about our time is that those who feel certainty are stupid, and those with any imagination and understanding are filled with doubt and indecision"
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#2 User is offline   SteveMoe 

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Posted 2015-January-03, 11:42

Double then . Need very little from partner for 6 to have play.
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#3 User is offline   ArtK78 

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Posted 2015-January-03, 12:26

I agree that you need little to make 6. Furthermore, it is virtually impossible for you to find out if partner has it. So I would just punt 6.

Second choice would be 5, but, again, it is impossible for partner to know what cards you need to make 6.

Double risks playing in 4x.
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#4 User is offline   the hog 

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Posted 2015-January-04, 02:20

I do t like the x and dont really see how it helps if pd bids 4h. Two options, 4s or 6. I guess 6.
"The King of Hearts a broadsword bears, the Queen of Hearts a rose." W. H. Auden.
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#5 User is offline   MrAce 

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Posted 2015-January-04, 04:22

4 for me. I can't be joking R/W
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#6 User is offline   Hanoi5 

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Posted 2015-January-04, 14:39

I think double then spades is better. I doubt partner will pass our double after this start. I believe 5 and then Spades would show a better hand and probably seem like a Majors two-suiter.

6 right away seems like the macho-man choice. If I don't trust my partner or don't want anything resembling scientific bidding, I'd choose that.

Finally, I'd be afraid of playing just 4 if I bid that. It's true, being red vs white it should be a good hand but how often will partner continue (with a hand that would pass the double, for example)?

View Postwyman, on 2012-May-04, 09:48, said:

Also, he rates to not have a heart void when he leads the 3.


View Postrbforster, on 2012-May-20, 21:04, said:

Besides playing for fun, most people also like to play bridge to win


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#7 User is offline   gnasher 

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Posted 2015-January-04, 17:48

This is the 21st Century. Double then 4 shows a flexible hand, not a slam try.

I'd bid 4, but if I wanted to take stronger action I'd bid 5, which sows a hand that is better than 4 and not good enough for 6.

The problem with any slam try is that partner won't know what we need, but just bidding slam is playing him for a lot of good cards..
... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
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#8 User is offline   PhilKing 

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Posted 2015-January-04, 17:57

Maybe double followed by 5 (over 4) is the way to go if we aim high - that will get us to 6 or 6 when it's right.

I think it's pretty close between that and a direct 4.
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#9 User is offline   rogerclee 

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Posted 2015-January-04, 18:02

I like double then 5S, once in awhile partner will be a champ and bid 6C for us. Second choice is to just bid 4S, which is pretty reasonable IMO. I think doubling and then bidding 4S shows a willingness to play hearts.
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#10 User is offline   whereagles 

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Posted 2015-January-04, 18:48

4. Don't complicate what is simple.
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#11 User is offline   mgoetze 

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Posted 2015-January-04, 18:58

View Postwhereagles, on 2015-January-04, 18:48, said:

4. Don't complicate what is simple.

And what's so simple about this?

As it turned out, partner had Tx AQxxxx xx Kxx and still did not dare to bid the slam even though I bid double-then-4. (I agree that double-then-4 should actually show a different hand type, but I had the additional information that Partner is still on chapter 1 of "Partnership Bidding at Bridge".)
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#12 User is offline   the hog 

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Posted 2015-January-04, 20:25

View PostPhilKing, on 2015-January-04, 17:57, said:

Maybe double followed by 5 (over 4) is the way to go if we aim high - that will get us to 6 or 6 when it's right.

I think it's pretty close between that and a direct 4.


Yes, on reflection, X followed by 5S is far better than a direct 6S.
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#13 User is offline   nige1 

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Posted 2015-January-04, 23:34

View Postmgoetze, on 2015-January-03, 10:44, said:



What's your plan?
No idea, so 4 = 10, Double = 9.
You might try something different with agreed meanings for
  • Jump to 5 -- Solid need outside help?
  • Double then 4 -- This hand?
  • Double then 5 -- Ask for control?
  • 4N then 5 - Two places to play?
  • 5 then 5 - Ask for help in ?

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#14 User is offline   rogerclee 

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Posted 2015-January-05, 16:30

View Postmgoetze, on 2015-January-04, 18:58, said:

And what's so simple about this?

As it turned out, partner had Tx AQxxxx xx Kxx and still did not dare to bid the slam even though I bid double-then-4. (I agree that double-then-4 should actually show a different hand type, but I had the additional information that Partner is still on chapter 1 of "Partnership Bidding at Bridge".)

FWIW I changed my mind to 4S and think this is not so close after all, we just need a little bit too much IMO to be driving to the 5 level and inviting 6.
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#15 User is offline   whereagles 

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Posted 2015-January-05, 18:15

View Postmgoetze, on 2015-January-04, 18:58, said:

And what's so simple about this?


It's simple because you have an easy bid. The fact you have a slam on and missed it is the reason people preempt.
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#16 User is offline   jogs 

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Posted 2015-January-07, 09:31

View Postmgoetze, on 2015-January-04, 18:58, said:

And what's so simple about this?

As it turned out, partner had Tx AQxxxx xx Kxx and still did not dare to bid the slam even though I bid double-then-4. (I agree that double-then-4 should actually show a different hand type, but I had the additional information that Partner is still on chapter 1 of "Partnership Bidding at Bridge".)


Looking at the table of contents of "Partnership Bidding at Bridge". Can't find what R/S does when they put the pressure on us.
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#17 User is offline   mgoetze 

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Posted 2015-January-07, 19:19

View Postjogs, on 2015-January-07, 09:31, said:

Looking at the table of contents of "Partnership Bidding at Bridge". Can't find what R/S does when they put the pressure on us.

Chapter 5.
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#18 User is offline   mcphee 

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Posted 2015-January-08, 03:53

I can't imagine even thinking of double. Although unlikely partner might pass. I have S and lots of them and now is the time to let partner know about them. If partner has a good hand maybe they will raise, and they will need some nice things for you to make 6.
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#19 User is offline   jogs 

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Posted 2015-January-08, 09:01

View Postmgoetze, on 2015-January-07, 19:19, said:

Chapter 5.

Just scanned chap 5. Mostly 3 level decisions.
Didn't see 4/5 level decisions.
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