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Im wondering if someone got data about the advantages of opening before your opponents.
Obviously the preempts and spades hands are going to be the big winners but if we remove the preempts is being dealer and opening before your opponents such a big advantage ?
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The value of being dealer. 1st seat vs 2nd seat raw score comparaison.
#1
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Posted 2014-December-10, 00:31
From Psych "I mean, Gus and I never see eye-to-eye on work stuff.
For instance, he doesn't like being used as a human shield when we're being shot at.
I happen to think it's a very noble way to meet one's maker, especially for a guy like him.
Bottom line is we never let that difference of opinion interfere with anything."
For instance, he doesn't like being used as a human shield when we're being shot at.
I happen to think it's a very noble way to meet one's maker, especially for a guy like him.
Bottom line is we never let that difference of opinion interfere with anything."
#2
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Posted 2014-December-10, 01:05
It's going to be huge c.f. 1C-(2S) vs (2S). Not sure it's going to be evidenced though because I'm not sure anyone has played a team match where the dealer wasn't symmetrical.
#3
- The Abbess
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Posted 2014-December-10, 02:24
It should be easy to research. Just count rhe average total points for dealer.
Cascade once made sims of it using the jack software and got the strange result that dealer had a disadvantage.
Cascade once made sims of it using the jack software and got the strange result that dealer had a disadvantage.
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#4
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Posted 2014-December-10, 02:31
helene_t, on 2014-December-10, 02:24, said:
It should be easy to research. Just count rhe average total points for dealer.
Cascade once made sims of it using the jack software and got the strange result that dealer had a disadvantage.
Cascade once made sims of it using the jack software and got the strange result that dealer had a disadvantage.
Could theoretically mean that Jack does not open light enough.
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#5
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Posted 2014-December-10, 02:50
helene_t, on 2014-December-10, 02:24, said:
It should be easy to research. Just count rhe average total points for dealer.
Cascade once made sims of it using the jack software and got the strange result that dealer had a disadvantage.
Cascade once made sims of it using the jack software and got the strange result that dealer had a disadvantage.
Nice memory.
I was going to post that actually I have played this team's match. It should be a very easy simulation to do. I never pursued this very much. It seems obvious that first seat should have an advantage but maybe not if you don't bid so well. There are certainly some situations where second seat has an advantage so maybe it is not so obvious. I mean we have all sat there thinking of making a dodgy opening bid, maybe a preempt, to find that 1st seat opens our suit.
I was not sure that I had used Jack but if I was to do this again I think I would use GIB.
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I believe that the USA currently hold only the World Championship For People Who Still Bid Like Your Auntie Gladys - dburn
dunno how to play 4 card majors - JLOGIC
True but I know Standard American and what better reason could I have for playing Precision? - Hideous Hog
Bidding is an estimation of probabilities SJ Simon
#6
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Posted 2014-December-10, 05:38
Cascade, on 2014-December-10, 02:50, said:
I was not sure that I had used Jack but if I was to do this again I think I would use GIB.
Just curious: Why?
Rik
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#7
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Posted 2014-December-10, 10:53
My idea is a long shot, if there is a weak nt in one of the seat and another opening bid (not preempt) in the other direction is it better for the weak Nt hand to be after or before the ennemy opening bid. Both 1m and 1nt opening will be interesting.
The result should give an idea if opening light balanced hand make some sense other than the expectation to have a plus score based on values.
Not only that but over 1m by opponents you can make a 1M overcall than is not a 1M opening, you can X and you can do 2 suiters bids. Also you get information if you end up declarer.
The result should give an idea if opening light balanced hand make some sense other than the expectation to have a plus score based on values.
Quote
I mean we have all sat there thinking of making a dodgy opening bid, maybe a preempt, to find that 1st seat opens our suit.
Not only that but over 1m by opponents you can make a 1M overcall than is not a 1M opening, you can X and you can do 2 suiters bids. Also you get information if you end up declarer.
From Psych "I mean, Gus and I never see eye-to-eye on work stuff.
For instance, he doesn't like being used as a human shield when we're being shot at.
I happen to think it's a very noble way to meet one's maker, especially for a guy like him.
Bottom line is we never let that difference of opinion interfere with anything."
For instance, he doesn't like being used as a human shield when we're being shot at.
I happen to think it's a very noble way to meet one's maker, especially for a guy like him.
Bottom line is we never let that difference of opinion interfere with anything."
#8
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Posted 2014-December-10, 13:13
I actually have something else I think I'm seeing in the wild, but I'd want to sim:
Clearly, you get more weak NTs than strong NTs as dealer; there are more balanced 12-14s than balanced 15-17s.
But do you get more weak NTs than strong NTs in any other seat? Because my memory of recent events says otherwise in second and third. The thing is that when you hold a balanced 12-14, dealer/second on average has more points than when you hold a balanced 15-17, and that means they open more often (so you don't get to open 1NT, but you do get to open 1m).
It's an interesting thought, because if you're playing weak NT primarily for it's preemptive value, and it turns out that in second seat, the strong NTers get to open the preemptive call more often than you do, should you be doing it?
Clearly, you get more weak NTs than strong NTs as dealer; there are more balanced 12-14s than balanced 15-17s.
But do you get more weak NTs than strong NTs in any other seat? Because my memory of recent events says otherwise in second and third. The thing is that when you hold a balanced 12-14, dealer/second on average has more points than when you hold a balanced 15-17, and that means they open more often (so you don't get to open 1NT, but you do get to open 1m).
It's an interesting thought, because if you're playing weak NT primarily for it's preemptive value, and it turns out that in second seat, the strong NTers get to open the preemptive call more often than you do, should you be doing it?
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#9
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Posted 2014-December-10, 14:25
I honestly don't think a sim would prove anything other than competitive bidding and balancing skills after the opponents have opened are the weakest areas in most partnerships.
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