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GCC or not Question about some conventional treatments

#1 User is offline   biggerclub 

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Posted 2014-July-22, 09:50

I am not all that familiar with the ins and outs of the ACBL's GCC, but here is what I would like to play in a serious partnership. Which, if any, are barred because they are not permitted by ACBL's GCC?

Strong hands (or possible strong hands):

1= most 16+ HCP hands, balanced or unbalanced (exceptions - See 2D and 2N)
. . . 1(Responder) = <9 HCP, any distribution

2= multi; that is, weak 2 in a MAJ OR 22-24 Balanced OR 16-24 4-4-4-1 with any singleton

2N = 20-21 Balanced

Limited Openings:

1 = 10-15 HCP, at least 2, denies 4 card or longer MAJ
1 = 10-15 HCP, at least 4, if 4-4 in MAJ may have equal length , may be unbalanced with longer minor
1 = 10-15 HCP, at least 4, if specifically 4, not 4, if 5+ may have equal or shorter 4+ suit
1NT = Seats 1-2 NV 10-12 HCP, balanced, no 4 card MAJ; all others 13-15 HCP, balanced, no 4 card MAJ
2 = 10+-15 HCP, No 4 card MAJ, usually 6+
2 = 10+-15 HCP, at least 5, unspecified minor of at least 4 cards (minor could be equal to or longer than ; for example 5-6)
2 = 10+-15 HCP, at least 5, unspecified minor of at least 4 cards (minor could be equal to or longer than ; for example 5-6)

3 bids and up = standard pre-empts with some tendency to take liberties with 6 card suits since the two level is reserved for other purposes.

NT Ranges:

10-12 HCP, if NV in seats 1-2 open 1 of 4 card MAJ holding one, or 1NT otherwise.
13-15 HCP, other than above, open 1 of 4 card MAJ holding one, or 1NT otherwise. If NV in seats 1-2, open 4 card MAJ or otherwise 1D and rebid 1NT.
16-17 HCP, open 1, rebid 1NT over 1.
18-19 HCP, open 1, rebid 2NT over 1.
20-21 HCP, open 2NT
22-23 HCP, open 2
24-26 HCP, open 1, rebid 3NT
With 27+ Balanced, open 1 and improvise forcing bids from there.

Major suit openings:

1 MAJ (O) 1NT ® 2min = canape. MAJ specifically 4 card length, min = longer.
2/1 is GF unless R rebids suit at 3-level. For example: 1 (O), 2 ®, 2 (O), 2 ® = forcing to game. 1 (O), 2 ®, 2 (O), 3 ® = 10-13 HCP good suit.

1 opening:

R tends NOT to bid 4 card MAJ suits, but may show a very strong 4 card suit. 1/1 response is forcing to 1NT (subject to exception for passed hand bidding).
2 = GF unless rebid.
2 = GF.
2 MAJ = Soloway (Strong) JS.
3 = INV raise.
3 = Pre-emptive.
3 MAJ = to play, similar to opening 3 bid.
2NT = 11-12; 3NT = 13-15/bad 16.

2 opening:
2 = artificial 1 round force with 10+HCP. Opener bids strong MAJ fragment max or min, 2N or 3 min, 3N max.
2 MAJ = NF attempt to improve contract.
2NT = 10+-12, INV.
3 = weak/pre-emptive.
3, 3, 3 = splinter slam seeking values.

2 responses, typical multi structure.

2MAJ responses . . . . nothing unusual or conventional here. New suits force 1 round. 2NT asks opener to bid min, but is often game going.
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#2 User is offline   awm 

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Posted 2014-July-22, 11:04

2D multi is not allowed on the general chart. The 2M openings are a bit of a gray area but really should be allowed since a WEAK 2M bid with the same shape is allowed.

I don't see any other issues.
Adam W. Meyerson
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#3 User is offline   chasetb 

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Posted 2014-July-22, 13:26

I concur that 2 as Multi is a Mid-Chart item. I also think the 2M openings are also NOT GCC-legal. You are promising two suits, but only show one of them, and the second suit is 4 or more, not only 4. While that is very picky, read Paul Gipson's comment on his response from Mike Flader at BridgeWinners. If you promised 6+ or 5+ with a minor suit, then it becomes legal.

EDIT (After mycroft's post) - I forgot to mention I strongly think that 2M showing 10-15, 5+ and a 4+ card second suit should be GCC-legal.
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#4 User is offline   mycroft 

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Posted 2014-July-22, 17:08

I agree with all the above. 2M should be legal since the equivalent with a "weak" hand is legal, but according to what's actually written, it's not. I have suggested to several people that somebody's going to say "well, if 6-12 is weak, then 7-13 is still weak, and...then 10-15, because it's not 'strong', and because at least half of it is clearly 'weak', should be allowed" eventually, and we can't afford to have that writing on the GCC (it was okay on the Mid-Chart, as it was one of those bids that required a *complete* explanation of the system along with the defence. Here? What's weak? To go along with "if 5=4 is legal, and 5=4+ is legal, why isn't 5+=5+ legal?"
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#5 User is offline   steve2005 

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Posted 2014-July-22, 17:29

Because the ACBL added a weak 2 type bid without thinking of the consequences. Where Intermediate 2 opening bids which are two-suiters are required to have two known suits (5-4 or better), the most obvious example of which is Flannery but applies to other 2 suiters.
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#6 User is offline   TylerE 

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Posted 2014-July-22, 21:47

If the 2M bids didn't promise the minor they'd certainly be legal - GCC has no purview over natural (NON-conventional) bids.
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#7 User is offline   biggerclub 

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Posted 2014-July-22, 22:57

View PostTylerE, on 2014-July-22, 21:47, said:

If the 2M bids didn't promise the minor they'd certainly be legal - GCC has no purview over natural (NON-conventional) bids.


Hmmmmm . . . so you are thinking 2MAJ shows 5+ MAJ (10-15 HCP), unbalanced is GCC legal? Even if we agree, thru notes to open Flannery type 5-4 hands 1?

To the community, how about it? Within the spirit as well as the letter of the law?
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#8 User is offline   biggerclub 

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Posted 2014-July-22, 23:29

Quote

REVISED (CHANGES IN BOLD, DELETIONS IN STRIKETHROUGH)

Strong hands (or possible strong hands):

1♣= most 16+ HCP hands, balanced or unbalanced (exceptions - See 2D and 2N)
. . . 1♦(Responder) = <9 HCP, any distribution

2♦= multi; that is, weak 2 in a MAJ OR 22-24 Balanced OR 16-24 4-4-4-1 with any singleton

2N = 20-21 Balanced

Limited Openings:

1♦ = 10-15 HCP, at least 2♦, denies 4 card or longer MAJ
1♥ = 10-15 HCP, at least 4♥, if 4-4 in MAJ may have equal length ♠, may bebalanced or if unbalanced with longer minor
1♠ = 10-15 HCP, at least 4♠, if specifically 4♠, not 4♥, if 5+♠ may have equal or shorter 4+♥ suit, balanced or if unbalanced with longer mino
1NT = Seats 1-2 NV 10-12 HCP, balanced, no 4 card MAJ; all others 13-15 HCP, balanced, no 4 card MAJ
2♣ = 10+-15 HCP, No 4 card MAJ, usually 6+♣
2♥ = 10+-15 HCP, at least 5♥, unspecified minor of at least 4 cards unbalanced(minor could be equal to or longer than ♥; for example 5-6)
2♠ = 10+-15 HCP, at least 5♠, unspecified minor of at least 4 cards unbalanced(lower ranking suit could be equal to or longer than ♠; for example 5-6)

3 bids and up = standard pre-empts with some tendency to take liberties with 6 card suits since the two level is reserved for other purposes.

NT Ranges:

10-12 HCP, if NV in seats 1-2 open 1 of 4 card MAJ holding one, or 1NT otherwise.
13-15 HCP, other than above, open 1 of 4 card MAJ holding one, or 1NT otherwise. If NV in seats 1-2, open 4 card MAJ or otherwise 1D and rebid 1NT.
16-17 HCP, open 1♣, rebid 1NT over 1♦.
18-19 HCP, open 1♣, rebid 2NT over 1♦.
20-21 HCP, open 2NT
22-23 HCP, open 2♦
24-26 HCP, open 1♣, rebid 3NT
With 27+ Balanced, open 1♣ and improvise forcing bids from there.

Major suit openings:

1 MAJ (O) 1NT ® 2min (O) = canape. MAJ specifically 4 card length, min = longer.
2/1 is GF unless R rebids suit at 3-level. For example: 1♥ (O), 2♣ ®, 2♦ (O), 2♥ ® = forcing to game. 1♥ (O), 2♣®, 2♦ (O), 3♣ ® = 10-13 HCP good ♣ suit.

1♦ opening:

R tends NOT to bid 4 card MAJ suits, but may show a very strong 4 card suit. 1/1 response is forcing to 1NT (subject to exception for passed hand bidding).
2♣ = GF unless ♣ rebid.
2♦ = GF.
2 MAJ = Soloway (Strong) JS.
3 ♣ = INV ♦ raise.
3 ♦ = Pre-emptive.
3 MAJ = to play, similar to opening 3 bid.
2NT = 11-12; 3NT = 13-15/bad 16.

2 ♣ opening:

2 ♦ = artificial 1 round force with 10+HCP. Opener bids strong MAJ fragment max or min, 2N or 3♣ min, 3N max.
2 MAJ = NF attempt to improve contract.
2NT = 10+-12, INV.
3 ♣ = weak/pre-emptive.
3♦, 3♥, 3♠ = splinter slam seeking values.

2♦ responses, typical multi structureto come -- generally using transfer principles with the benefit of more space.

2MAJ responses . . . . nothing unusual or conventional here. New suits force 1 round. 2NT asks opener to bid min out shape, but is often game going. 3 as artificial game force [?]
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#9 User is offline   Mbodell 

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Posted 2014-July-23, 04:28

View Postbiggerclub, on 2014-July-22, 22:57, said:

Hmmmmm . . . so you are thinking 2MAJ shows 5+ MAJ (10-15 HCP), unbalanced is GCC legal? Even if we agree, thru notes to open Flannery type 5-4 hands 1?

To the community, how about it? Within the spirit as well as the letter of the law?


5+ unbalanced is fine. Note this includes 6331, right? So you are no longer guaranteed the 4+ minor.
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