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Multi 2C Strong or weak with spades or diamonds

#1 User is offline   Kungsgeten 

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Posted 2013-February-04, 16:11

Hi!

I read on a homepage (can not remember which one) about an opening of 2C being either standard (strong, typically GF or 22+ bal) or a weak 2 in diamonds or spades. I have played 2C as strong or weak in diamonds, but not including spades in the mix. Does anyone have experience using this convention?

The scheme looks something like this, including weak spade hands in the Kokish relay:

2C;
2D - ART. Non-forcing relay
2H - ART. Forcing relay

2C-2D;
Pass - Weak with diamonds
2H - Strong with hearts OR strong balanced OR weak with spades
...2S - ART. The usual bid
......Pass - Weak with spades
......2NT - Strong and balanced
......3C+ - Strong with hearts, perhaps using transfers to show the side suit
...2NT - ART. Forcing, guessing that partner has spades
2S+ - Natural and strong

2C-2H;
(just a basic structure)
2S - Spades and min
2N - Spades and max
3C - Diamonds and min
3D - Diamonds and max
Other - Strong and natural

I think it would work okay undisturbed, but when the opponents interfere it may be hard. I don't know if its harder than over regular 2D multi, but still.


Me and a partner plays short club (5542) and usually 2C strong, 2D mini-multi, 2M as 10-13 with 6 card suit and 2NT as 22-24 bal. We quite like the 10-13 openings, but there's a problem when holding 6-4 majors in this range, especially 6 hearts and 4 spades. We're also not quite enjoying the multi. My partner has been talking about wanting to try 2NT as unusual too, and I've been talking about trying Flannery (which would solve the 6-4 majors problem when using 2M 10-13). Here's a structure I'm thinking about suggesting:

2C: any GF OR 20+ bal (22-24 goes via Kokish) OR weak two in diamonds OR weak two in spades
2D: 11-16, 5+ hearts and 4 spades (Flannery)
2H: 10-13 with 6 hearts
2S: 10-13 with 6 spades (6-4 opens 1S and rebids hearts)
2NT: 5-5 minors

Compared to our current structure we lose the weak two in hearts but gains Flannery, Unusual and the weak two in diamonds. The Unusual and weak two in diamonds could be solved in the current structure though with minor modifications.
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#2 User is offline   glen 

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Posted 2013-February-04, 16:27

I played something like this, described here:

http://www.bridgemat...om/weakstng.htm

The 2NT opening (natural or weak in one of the rounded) was more fun.
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#3 User is offline   Cthulhu D 

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Posted 2013-February-04, 17:52

Yeah, I play basically Glenn's proposed 2C method, some observations. We play 2C-2H is a super negative, and our responder invitational hands start 2C-2NT. This lacks grace and your responses are by necessity cramped, I do like your idea of a 2H relay. Definitely define what you do with strong hands after the relay - this has happened to us a couple of times and it can be tough to find a slam when you're starting exploration at 3NT. There is probably a case for making 3C and 3H strong/weak bids, but I haven't really thought about.

As for the two level prempts, we play 2C as described, 2D as diamonds + a major assumed fit style, 2H as both majors assumed fit style and 2S as a preempt in a minor suit or a good 3M preempt, 3C as both minors and 3D as 6 diamonds 4 majors exactly.

The 2C bid is very effective - while similar bids are fairly routine, it is always slippery to defend against unanchored pre-empts. Opponents are much less likely to pre-empt you I find too, but you get most of those benefits just playing 2C: Strong or Diamonds.

I am unsatisfied with the 2D bid, we are thinking of changing to Wilkoz or playing it diamonds and hearts or something.
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#4 User is offline   Hilver 

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Posted 2013-February-05, 03:51

Isn't this a Brown Sticker Convention?

Brown sticker is a category of contract bridge conventional agreements defined by the World Bridge Federation (WBF).

Brown sticker conventions are considered, by some, to be difficult to defend against, and thus are only permitted at the highest levels of tournament play in most locations. Only highly unusual methods (HUMs) have a higher classification.

The official definition can be found on the WBF website.[1]

A short summary would be that a convention qualifies for a brown sticker if it fulfills any of the following criteria:

1. An opening bid of 2♣ through 3♠ may be weak and does not promise a known suit.
2. An overcall of a natural opening at the one level does not promise 4 cards in a known suit.
3. A weak two-suited bid where one of the suits by definition may be only 3 cards or shorter.
It is used for protection of psychic bids, or systemically required psyches.
Notable exceptions are the Multi 2 diamonds (due to its popularity), a natural 1NT overcall, and cue bids on strong hands to force partner.

The bottom line is, that if a bid is weak (or potentially weak having multiple options) and does not promise 4 cards in a defined suit (when weak) then it is likely to have a brown sticker.


Jan
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#5 User is offline   helene_t 

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Posted 2013-February-05, 04:02

yes its a brown sticker but you can stil play it in many places. In EBU it would be OK at level IV.
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#6 User is offline   Kungsgeten 

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Posted 2013-February-05, 04:44

Its legal at all levels in Sweden (where I live and play), but I've never seen anyone use it. The exception would be if a club has local rules only allowing certain systems (for instance beginner evenings) or if the rest of the opening bids makes the system to "wierd". Each opening bid is given a value, based on how hard it is to defend, and the system's total value may not exceed a fixed number. At the lowest level this fixed number is 7, and this bid has a value of 3. Here's some other popular bids and their point values (for the interested):

Standard American 1C/1D openings: 1 point each, due to the fact that it only promises 3 cards in the suit bid.

Precision: 1C gets 0 points (strong openings never get points), but 1D gets 3 points since it may be less than 3 cards, even when unbalanced. 2D gets 1 point since it doesn't promise length in diamonds but 4+ cards in another suit (clubs).

Short club: 1C gets 2 points if 2+ (natural or balanced) and 3 points if 1+.

Multi (doesn't matter if 2C, 2D or 2H): 3 points, it doesn't show length in the suit bid nor length in another suit.

Swedish Club / Polish club: 3 points for these 1C openings, since the bid does not promise length in the suit bid and isn't strong.

MOSCITO: 1D, 1H and 1S gets 1 point each. They do not promise length in the suit bid, but 4+ cards in another suit.

An Unassuming Club / Fantunes 1C: 1C gets 1 point since its either strong (15+) or natural (4+ clubs)

Flannery / Ekren 2D / Unusual 2NT / Verdi: 1 point each, for the same reason as MOSCITO, Precision 2D etc.

2NT as something wierd: 2 points, this is the max for 2NT (for instance 2NT as 5-5 in two unknown suits)

Ferts: These are "expensive" if at the 1-level. 1C is 3 points, 1D is 5 points and 1M is 7 points.

Weak bids: There's no difference if the bid is weak or strong, if not a fert.

Muiderberg: 0 points, considered natural since it shows 4+ cards in the suit bid.

2C as strong or diamonds: A bid which is either strong or shows 4+ cards in a specified suit (other than the suit bid) is 2 points.

Gambling 3NT / Namyats / Icebreaker: 0 points. Bids of 3NT or higher is always 0 points.

Forcing pass: 0 points, but the answers to the pass gets points as if they where opening bids unless the pass always is strong (15+).
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