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Suggested auction?

#1 User is offline   Coelacanth 

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Posted 2012-March-05, 13:36

IMPs, vul vs not



(spots approximate)

Methods:
2 is an artificial game force, ambiguous as to spade holding
3 would probably be interpreted as a splinter by partner, but you have no explicit agreement about this sequence
4 would be ambiguous; you have discussed playing Minorwood with this partner, but have not added it to your card

It looks like you might belong in any strain except spades. How do you proceed?

Spoiler

Brian Weikle
I say what it occurs to me to say when I think I hear people say things; more, I cannot say.
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#2 User is offline   mgoetze 

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Posted 2012-March-05, 13:50

If 2 is forcing, I bid 2. If 2 is not forcing, I bid 2, unless perhaps I feel like bidding 3. Also, if 2 is not forcing, I will consider changing my methods. ;)
"One of the painful things about our time is that those who feel certainty are stupid, and those with any imagination and understanding are filled with doubt and indecision"
    -- Bertrand Russell
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#3 User is offline   Codo 

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Posted 2012-March-05, 14:11

At imps I need not to aim for the major. It is very likely that partner has short hearts anyway. If he has short spades, opponents silence would not be reasonable.

I go with 2 and raise clubs later.
Kind Regards

Roland


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More system is not the answer...
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#4 User is offline   TWO4BRIDGE 

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Posted 2012-March-05, 15:01

I'm going with the 3! splinter.
Don Stenmark
TWOferBRIDGE
"imo by far in bridge the least understood concept is how to bid over a jump-shift
( 1M-1NT!-3m-?? )." ....Justin Lall

" Did someone mention relays? " .... Zelandakh

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#5 User is offline   aguahombre 

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Posted 2012-March-05, 15:47

The masters way back "when" agreed that even though a jump to 3 would only be an invite after a 1NT rebid, it was clearly forcing when responder could not be assured opener even held one of them, such as this case. Some of us old fossils still believe in that idea.

The problem with 3S is that it addresses the club support, but not the great heart suit, and we really can't recover from that; but we can conceivably get to the club support after 3H ---if we want to, depending on opener's continuation.

Especially for B/I, this is worth thinking about adopting, and eliminating one more thing from 4th suit forcing.
"Bidding Spades to show spades can work well." (Kenberg)
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#6 User is offline   mike777 

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Posted 2012-March-05, 17:24

View PostCoelacanth, on 2012-March-05, 13:36, said:

IMPs, vul vs not



(spots approximate)

Methods:
2 is an artificial game force, ambiguous as to spade holding
3 would probably be interpreted as a splinter by partner, but you have no explicit agreement about this sequence
4 would be ambiguous; you have discussed playing Minorwood with this partner, but have not added it to your card

It looks like you might belong in any strain except spades. How do you proceed?

Spoiler



I will stay low and start with 2s.

over 3c I bid 4d rkc for clubs not natural I want to be the one who bids rkc not pard with h as a source of tricks.

I would bid 3d over 3c to set d as trumps.
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#7 User is online   P_Marlowe 

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Posted 2012-March-06, 06:23

2S.

Partner may still have 3 hearts.

With kind regards
Marlowe
With kind regards
Uwe Gebhardt (P_Marlowe)
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#8 User is offline   Cyberyeti 

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Posted 2012-March-06, 07:10

View PostP_Marlowe, on 2012-March-06, 06:23, said:

2S.

Partner may still have 3 hearts.

With kind regards
Marlowe

Only if opps have an undisclosed 11 or 12 card spade fit at favourable, unlikely, partner is most likely 3154/3055 or just maybe 2155/2164/2065 in my world view becoming one of the 5+-5 shapes when he bids 3.
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#9 User is offline   TWO4BRIDGE 

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Posted 2012-March-06, 07:27

View PostCoelacanth, on 2012-March-05, 13:36, said:

IMPs, vul vs not



The 3S! splinter does more than show a stiff and 4 cards , it ostensibly shows GF values ( because of forcing the bidding to the 4-level ) and therefore shows that the 1H response was at least 5 cards . [ Also some measure of support has been shown . Partner is now in a much better position to proceed ].

Why? Because with GF values and only 4 cards , Responder would have bid 2C! ( 2/1 GF ) over 1D .
Don Stenmark
TWOferBRIDGE
"imo by far in bridge the least understood concept is how to bid over a jump-shift
( 1M-1NT!-3m-?? )." ....Justin Lall

" Did someone mention relays? " .... Zelandakh

K-Rex to Mikeh : " Sometimes you drive me nuts " .
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#10 User is offline   Zelandakh 

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Posted 2012-March-06, 07:37

View PostTWO4BRIDGE, on 2012-March-06, 07:27, said:

Why? Because with GF values and only 4 cards , Responder would have bid 2C! ( 2/1 GF ) over 1D .

I don't think it is standard to bid 2 over 1 with x/AKJx/Kxxx/QJxx is it? Given the conditions laid out in the OP I think 2 is best - a game-forcing hand without clear direction.
(-: Zel :-)
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#11 User is offline   Coelacanth 

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Posted 2012-March-06, 09:17

As always, thanks to everyone for their replies. I probably should have mentioned that we were not playing 2/1. Partner would not be interested in any subtle inferences about my heart length anyway; he had a heart void. The hand was approximately (my hand repeated for convenience)



At our table, I declared 4 on the lead of the (singleton) 2. I flew Ace, crossed in diamonds, and played 3 rounds of trump. My RHO didn't think I could have (only) 6 hearts and (as many as) 4 clubs, so he exited with a spade. Making 4.

At the other table, the auction was something like: 1-1; 2-2; 3-3; 3-6. My teammate thought opener was showing the A, and thus led a heart from KQxx Qxx xxx KTx. Making 6.

I think any reasonable set of agreements should let you stop in 5 with these cards; time for more discussion with partner.
Brian Weikle
I say what it occurs to me to say when I think I hear people say things; more, I cannot say.
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#12 User is offline   mike777 

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Posted 2012-March-06, 20:17

View PostCoelacanth, on 2012-March-06, 09:17, said:

As always, thanks to everyone for their replies. I probably should have mentioned that we were not playing 2/1. Partner would not be interested in any subtle inferences about my heart length anyway; he had a heart void. The hand was approximately (my hand repeated for convenience)



At our table, I declared 4 on the lead of the (singleton) 2. I flew Ace, crossed in diamonds, and played 3 rounds of trump. My RHO didn't think I could have (only) 6 hearts and (as many as) 4 clubs, so he exited with a spade. Making 4.

At the other table, the auction was something like: 1-1; 2-2; 3-3; 3-6. My teammate thought opener was showing the A, and thus led a heart from KQxx Qxx xxx KTx. Making 6.

I think any reasonable set of agreements should let you stop in 5 with these cards; time for more discussion with part



3d by south over 3c was a pretty weird bid.. as was 3s.
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