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BB Forums vs JEC (Regular Team Game) Need your input

#1 User is online   MrAce 

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Posted 2012-February-01, 14:33

Hi folks.

As most of you know Jimmy Cayne, sponsoring famous Italians and Anerican pros arranges regular team games in BBO twice a day. Larry Lande is the person who organise and directs these games for Jimmy.

I thought it could be exciting if we (BBF regulars) can come up with a team vs JEC and his top worldclass partners / teammates once a week.

This will not only allow us to play vs top level worldclass players, but also create a lot of material to debate in the forums after the match. Not to pick up on our teammates or whitch hunt of course.

I am thinking we have a lot of players here pottentially can play at these games. And due to my relation with LL i think i can have 1 day every week (except during nationals and world champ events) reserved for us to play vs JEC. But i didnt want to make promises before i check it with you.

1- What do you think ? Is this a good or bad idea ?

2-If the answer to 1st question is good, then we can talk about it more about ( when, which day and time, who, how etc etc) if u guys think it is not a good idea or that it wont work ...oh well, no hard feelings.


Thanks to all who replies.

EDIT: If you dont want to write your opinion publicly for whatever reason, please feel free to email me turkofla@hotmail.com
"Genius has its own limitations, however stupidity is boundless"

"Gosh given your bbf manner would love to see your teaching LOL if i was a novice i'd be running a million miles from you" - Eagles123

Disclaimer: this post is not intended to offend anyone who spews constant drivel. --PhilKing (Stolen from Arend's sig)






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#2 User is offline   bluecalm 

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Posted 2012-February-01, 14:52

I for one would be excited to play in such thing with my regular internet pd.
I think if we try pick-up forum partnership we wouldn't represent enough challenge :)
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#3 User is offline   Flameous 

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Posted 2012-February-01, 15:05

Would the players/partnerships be cycling regularly or would it basically be just one team from BBF always playing?
I'd have no problem playing occasionally with my partner, but couldn't promise anything regular.

Would be good practice to get beaten by some pros :lol:


Good idea and could get some more attention for the forums :)
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#4 User is offline   Phil 

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Posted 2012-February-01, 15:08

Sathya and I are in.
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#5 User is offline   billw55 

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Posted 2012-February-01, 15:20

Sounds like a great idea, for so many reasons. If you name the team "BBO forums" or the like, we would probably pick up a lot of lurker traffic, and a fair number of registered users as well. Not to mention all the thread fodder and just plain fun rooting for the team.

Of course I would love to play, as almost everyone would. But I recognize that my skills do not warrant such a privilege.

Good luck team BBOF! Let's get ready to rummmmmmble
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#6 User is offline   mikeh 

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Posted 2012-February-01, 15:22

I don't have a partner who is a regular bbf contributor, tho I have one who occasionally lurks. I have two partners I could probably persuade to do this at least sporadically.
'one of the great markers of the advance of human kindness is the howls you will hear from the Men of God' Johann Hari
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#7 User is online   hrothgar 

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Posted 2012-February-01, 15:38

If I might make a suggestion...

We could (should) use the chance to play against Cayne as some kind of incentive.

For example, hypothetically, we could run a knockout lead
Teams form, play each other over the course of a month or two months
Whatever team wins gets to play Cayne

This would

1. Create an interesting opportunity for the forum regulars
2. Provide an objective way of picking who plays Cayne
3. Help ensure that we don't send out a team of scrubs

Alternatively, we could have the winner of the Bridge Pool online (and partner) get one of the coveted slots...
Alderaan delenda est
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#8 User is offline   jillybean 

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Posted 2012-February-01, 16:28

Fabulous idea. I assume any teams will be made up of bbf superstars and not mere mortals?

I like Richard's idea of a knockout lead. Perhaps pairs could face off and the top 2 pairs then form a team.
3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th top pairs could form teams 2 and 3?
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#9 User is online   MrAce 

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Posted 2012-February-01, 16:30

Ok, i will try to answer some of the questions;

- The name of our team in my mind was BBF or BBF Regs

- How shall we choose our team and will it be always same team or cycle ? Very good question btw.

This is where it gets tuff. I may have choosen to keep this idea to myself , talk privately to decent players in forums and arrange the teams. But i wanted this excitement to be shared by all of us and this team to be seen as our own team and share the victory or defeat and debates alltogether. Now i remember the debate about giving stars to people in BBO and what Fred said about how hard it is to do this without upsetting people unless you have required criterias.

The plan i have in my mind is to cycle the team. It gets tricky here and I will beg all of your help/patience/forgiving while i try to do this. I am still working/emailing/discussing this with people and of course mainly listening to you guys here, all will be written soon. But shortly, imagine this, EVERY WEEK is a lot. We will have enough matches for everyone in long run.

We have time untill the end of next nationals, after that we will be assigned a day of a week and time. LL told me we can even start right away but i wanted to make sure we are organised to fullfit our promises in regards to our consistency.

As i said i want this to be belong to all of us but mainly A/E regulars for obvious reasons. After all one of the reasons JEC doing this is to practice for nationals or other big events and our team should be consistent with his expectations. He is not expecting us to come up with OMG team. He needs reasonable and HONEST opponents. We have more than he asks for imo.

This was one of 2 plans i had in my mind. First one was to ask Fred to give us power to organise tourney in BBO, so we forum regulars can organise an individual every week. We all love this game, we debate here theoretical issues, card plays, defenses, we poke each other, point fingers, get sarcastic or pet each other on the shoulder time to time. I thought it would be nice for us to be able to leave all this "on the paper" aside and play the game we love with the people that we discuss hands everyday. It kinda feels weird to me to discuss so many things about bridge with people and never get to play with or against them. Perhaps thats just me. :)
"Genius has its own limitations, however stupidity is boundless"

"Gosh given your bbf manner would love to see your teaching LOL if i was a novice i'd be running a million miles from you" - Eagles123

Disclaimer: this post is not intended to offend anyone who spews constant drivel. --PhilKing (Stolen from Arend's sig)






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#10 User is offline   rogerclee 

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Posted 2012-February-01, 16:34

View Posthrothgar, on 2012-February-01, 15:38, said:

If I might make a suggestion...

We could (should) use the chance to play against Cayne as some kind of incentive.

For example, hypothetically, we could run a knockout lead
Teams form, play each other over the course of a month or two months
Whatever team wins gets to play Cayne

This would

1. Create an interesting opportunity for the forum regulars
2. Provide an objective way of picking who plays Cayne
3. Help ensure that we don't send out a team of scrubs

Alternatively, we could have the winner of the Bridge Pool online (and partner) get one of the coveted slots...


Not that the Cayne games aren't great, but it is not like they are super exclusive matches filled with only world class players. Most of the times it's closer to being like a random star team game. I don't think a trial is necessary, any 4 of the best players on this forum would be favorites to beat a random Cayne team (though not a Cayne-Lauria-Versace-Duboin team, heh).
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#11 User is online   MrAce 

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Posted 2012-February-01, 16:37

View Posthrothgar, on 2012-February-01, 15:38, said:

If I might make a suggestion...

We could (should) use the chance to play against Cayne as some kind of incentive.

For example, hypothetically, we could run a knockout lead
Teams form, play each other over the course of a month or two months
Whatever team wins gets to play Cayne

This would

1. Create an interesting opportunity for the forum regulars
2. Provide an objective way of picking who plays Cayne
3. Help ensure that we don't send out a team of scrubs

Alternatively, we could have the winner of the Bridge Pool online (and partner) get one of the coveted slots...



Thats not a bad idea on paper. Here is what happens in long run (i am saying this because i was asked to regularly bring a team vs JEC every week in the past and it didnt work..) It is very tuff to follow every week this agenda. Its even tuff only to come up with 4 people EVERY WEEK even if we had a coach choosing 4 players of his own choice. It doesnt work that way, people can not or may not be able to do this task every week if they are choosen every week.

Also the goal is not to get our best team against them ( of course goal is not "not to get our best team" there either )

The more complicated we make this, the harder it becomes to continue. As i said, i predict in less than 3-4 months we will be looking, begging to people to play this. It aint as easy as it looks unless we keep it simple.
"Genius has its own limitations, however stupidity is boundless"

"Gosh given your bbf manner would love to see your teaching LOL if i was a novice i'd be running a million miles from you" - Eagles123

Disclaimer: this post is not intended to offend anyone who spews constant drivel. --PhilKing (Stolen from Arend's sig)






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#12 User is online   MrAce 

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Posted 2012-February-01, 16:46

Another thing, imo, to keep the spirit of these games in the borders of BBO Forums, i suggest we should not play with our best pd IF he/she is not writing in forums regularly.

@ MikeH: Mike i have nothing but mad respect for you and this respect is not limited to your skills at this game. I can not think of our team to be without you, Andy, Frances, Phil and a lot more names that we all know. Please dont tell me you wont play unless you play with someone that none of us know here. Please dont tell me there is no one in these forums u cant play 28 boards when we need you to :)

EDIT to everyone: I am in no way or form telling that i should be the one choosing who gets to play. This is something we all here should decide. I am the one who has responsibilities to LL. Whichever u guys decide to choose, you need to give me the rooster every week, and sub names in case someone has a problem to make it to game on last second.
"Genius has its own limitations, however stupidity is boundless"

"Gosh given your bbf manner would love to see your teaching LOL if i was a novice i'd be running a million miles from you" - Eagles123

Disclaimer: this post is not intended to offend anyone who spews constant drivel. --PhilKing (Stolen from Arend's sig)






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#13 User is offline   FM75 

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Posted 2012-February-01, 16:53

Choice of team name - BBF Regs is maybe too close to BBF Rags.

-- Great idea! Good luck putting it together! (Have you asked Fred for any sponsorship money? ;) He could at least give you space on the ad billboard... )


$0.02
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#14 User is offline   bluecalm 

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Posted 2012-February-01, 17:06

I am ready to play in those with my reg internet pd. I have no credentials besides being bbf regular and he is not bbf regular but he is European and World univ champion.
We are amateurs who don't play much bridge but we likely won't give too many imps for free :)
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#15 User is offline   benlessard 

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Posted 2012-February-01, 19:00

Im in for sure, however we should make some team qualifier like a mini round robin would be nice. In fact its a crime we are not running an BBO league.
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#16 User is offline   mikeh 

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Posted 2012-February-01, 19:23

View PostMrAce, on 2012-February-01, 16:46, said:

Another thing, imo, to keep the spirit of these games in the borders of BBO Forums, i suggest we should not play with our best pd IF he/she is not writing in forums regularly.

@ MikeH: Mike i have nothing but mad respect for you and this respect is not limited to your skills at this game. I can not think of our team to be without you, Andy, Francis, Phil and a lot more names that we all know. Please dont tell me you wont play unless you play with someone that none of us know here. Please dont tell me there is no one in these forums u cant play 28 boards when we need you to :)

EDIT to everyone: I am in no way or form telling that i should be the one choosing who gets to play. This is something we all here should decide. I am the one who has responsibilities to LL. Whichever u guys decide to choose, you need to give me the rooster every week, and sub names in case someone has a problem to make it to game on last second.



Ok....the problem is that when one plays these kinds of matches...we played the israeli national team and a couple of other strong teams in practice for the BB....one doesn't want to be embarrassed by having gaps in partnership agreements come out, and they will absolutely come out, usually with devestating consequences. This means that two players who haven't played together before have to choose between doing a lot of work for what is really an exhibition series or winging it or (perhaps) being permitted to communicate during the match, which seems a solution that is worse, in many ways, than the problem.

It's not as if I am likely to establish a regular partnership with anyone here....not because of any unwillngness on my part but because playing bridge, rather than writing about it, is currently far down on my life priorities.....I simply don't travel to play bridge. And regular BBO just isn't interesting to me.

I'm not saying 'no', but I am saying that these are issues that for me and, I suspect, some others, are real impediments. I know that some of the best posters here do play with and against each other on a fairly frequent basis, so perhaps the forum team is best made up of those players.

Oh: the idea of a qualifying round robin almost certainly rules me out....there is only so much time in my life for bridge, and the demands of that would rule me out....to say nothing of the S.A.F. (anyone into audiophile stereo equipment will be familiar with the acronym).
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#17 User is offline   MickyB 

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Posted 2012-February-01, 19:26

View PostMrAce, on 2012-February-01, 16:37, said:

As i said, i predict in less than 3-4 months we will be looking, begging to people to play this. It aint as easy as it looks unless we keep it simple.


This. If you are happy to do so, I think you should just sort the team, compromising between the strongest team available and rotation as you see fit.

Quote

Another thing, imo, to keep the spirit of these games in the borders of BBO Forums, i suggest we should not play with our best pd IF he/she is not writing in forums regularly.


Agree in principle, but as you say, you'll probably be struggling for numbers a few months down the line, at which time being flexible on this point would make your life much easier!

I'd be interested in playing with one of my regular partners if needed.
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#18 User is offline   Flameous 

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Posted 2012-February-02, 02:45

Some thoughts regarding earlier posts.

First for what comes to agreeing system, there hasn't really been a problem in Cayne matches for asking something. They have even asked for elementary stuff like 0314 or 1403. Sure it's better with people who have some firm agreements but I don't see it that big a problem.

What comes to playing a TM to qualify, it seems a lot of work (I still remember winning Christmas Swiss teams bit too easily year back ;)) though I'd like to get some top pairs. I'm not actually sure if forum regs form any regular partnerships? But I'd say they are stronger than pairs that play first time together.

I'd suggest this to follow some kind of pattern where we have the core of 4 pairs who play, one team every other week. If a "top pair" like this can't make it, the fill in is from the larger pool of forum regulars. (And possibly partners off the forums if it goes to that) This would help to keep the quality of the team high quite constantly, yet during long periods of time, all regulars would get chance to play.

Also I'd suggest it's the skipping pairs' job to get the subs and not MrAces, though if you know it two weeks in advance or something, it's quite easily handled with one forum post I think :rolleyes:

With all this said, it seems it's time to force my partner to forums :P He's been reading some stuff here anyhow so might as well make appearance.
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#19 User is offline   Fluffy 

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Posted 2012-February-02, 03:56

I would love to play if the time permits (I supose everyone will have the same problem). My regular partners are unrelated to BBF so I would be fine playing with any forum regular, I´d be honnored to play with any star like mikeh.


My experience says that this needs a lot of planning, and cylcing would make it even harded, having a core of players and some substitutions requires a lot less work than some cycling where some players forget they have to play and nobody knows untill its too late. We all want to have the best team-mates at the other table I supose :)


I love this idea for some reasons I will tell you privatelly.
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#20 User is offline   mgoetze 

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Posted 2012-February-02, 04:11

View PostFlameous, on 2012-February-02, 02:45, said:

What comes to playing a TM to qualify, it seems a lot of work (I still remember winning Christmas Swiss teams bit too easily year back ;))


I was thinking all the time I was reading from hrothgar's post to yours that I should probably mention that. ;)

In any case I agree that once a week is quite often and we will certainly get enough slots for all the truly good players on BBF. The problem will be determining who those truly good players are, I think there a few(*) regular posters with rather inflated self-estimation here ... but we'll see what happens.

I've been thinking of having another try at the BBF tournament BTW. Maybe for Easter. But this time I would ask for registrations first and only then start discussing rules, with only the team captains having a say. Anyone with an opinion on the best way to get such a tournament going should feel free to contact me privately.

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(*) This is not meant to be an euphemism, I really mean a small amount.
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