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Rick Perry vs. Barack Obama The campaign has begun

#21 User is offline   PassedOut 

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Posted 2011-August-18, 11:05

View Postblackshoe, on 2011-August-18, 10:32, said:

Found this video amusing. And here's an article on the same topic. While I agree that Paul is unlikely to win the GOP nomination, why do the media think they have the right to decide for whom we should vote? The media's job is to report what's going on, not to selectively edit reality to fit their own agenda.

Absolutely. I watched that show with my son and Stewart's commentary was right on the mark in my view. The media coverage is absolutely unfair to Ron Paul.

Media: Just report what actually happens, please!
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#22 User is offline   luke warm 

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Posted 2011-August-18, 13:30

View PostPassedOut, on 2011-August-18, 11:05, said:

Media: Just report what actually happens, please!

you need to watch more of shep on fox, he's always fair and balanced
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#23 User is offline   Winstonm 

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Posted 2011-August-18, 17:15

Now the good reverand Perry is bragging that HIS state teaches creationsim and evolution, and that he thinks kids are smart enough to figure out which one is right.

Meanwhile, here in good 'ol boy Oklahoma, Perry has a huge lead in the Republican Presidential polls.

It seems the bible belt Republicans support a return to The Dark Ages, while the Democratic Party has no idea what it supports, but it kind of likes the 1980s version of Republicanism - and the album Best of the Bee Gees.

At what exact point in time did America lose its collective mind?
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#24 User is offline   luke warm 

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Posted 2011-August-19, 03:58

View PostWinstonm, on 2011-August-18, 17:15, said:

At what exact point in time did America lose its collective mind?

maybe you can be the new 'czar of intelligence and sanity'
"Paul Krugman is a stupid person's idea of what a smart person sounds like." Newt Gingrich (paraphrased)
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#25 User is offline   kenberg 

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Posted 2011-August-19, 05:11

Actually, we have always been a bit nuts. It's just that it matters more at some times than at others.
Ken
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#26 User is offline   Winstonm 

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Posted 2011-August-19, 05:47

View Postluke warm, on 2011-August-19, 03:58, said:

maybe you can be the new 'czar of intelligence and sanity'


That sounds too much like work. We progressives have the Maynard G. Krebs syndrome when it comes to the "W" word.
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#27 User is offline   hrothgar 

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Posted 2011-August-19, 06:46

View PostPassedOut, on 2011-August-18, 11:05, said:

Absolutely. I watched that show with my son and Stewart's commentary was right on the mark in my view. The media coverage is absolutely unfair to Ron Paul.

Media: Just report what actually happens, please!


Ron Paul's showing in the Iowa straw pool was an event, however, it doesn't strike me as newsworthy in any way, shape, or form.

Ron Paul has run for president on multiple occasions; each time, demonstrating that he has a following that is an inch wide and a mile deep. Paul has consistently demonstrated that he can turn out his fans and he does great in events the reward having small numbers of very dedicated followers. However, he is a completely insignificant factor in actual elections.

Ron Paul placed well in Iowa
This morning, the sun rose in the East

Both of these are facts
Neither warrants excessive amounts of news coverage, because neither event is at all unexpected or surprising.

The reason that Bachman is getting significant amounts of coverage is that she is new.
Romney gets coverage because he's the front runner.
Paul doesn't get coverage because he demonstrated how inconsequential he is the last time around.
(He placed 6th in New Hampshire, for god's sake and didn't get a single delegate)

Who knows, maybe the tides are turning...
Maybe Paul will place decently is a real electoral contest...

I trust that if/when that happens, there might be a bit more coverage
Alderaan delenda est
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#28 User is offline   luke warm 

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Posted 2011-August-19, 06:56

View PostWinstonm, on 2011-August-19, 05:47, said:

That sounds too much like work. We progressives have the Maynard G. Krebs syndrome when it comes to the "W" word.

good point...
"Paul Krugman is a stupid person's idea of what a smart person sounds like." Newt Gingrich (paraphrased)
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#29 User is offline   PassedOut 

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Posted 2011-August-19, 08:10

View Posthrothgar, on 2011-August-19, 06:46, said:

Ron Paul's showing in the Iowa straw pool was an event, however, it doesn't strike me as newsworthy in any way, shape, or form.

I understand your points about Ron Paul, but the Iowa straw poll itself was the event and the media treated the whole event as newsworthy. The reporting should have been that Bachmann edged out Ron Paul and forced Tim Pawlenty out of the race.

One clip I found remarkable had a reporter being told that he should skip covering Ron Paul's speech and try to get a video of Sarah Palin getting off her bus. I think people have already seen that Palin can get off her bus unassisted, but lots of folks have no idea what Ron Paul's ideas are.
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#30 User is offline   hrothgar 

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Posted 2011-August-19, 08:48

View PostPassedOut, on 2011-August-19, 08:10, said:

I understand your points about Ron Paul, but the Iowa straw poll itself was the event and the media treated the whole event as newsworthy. The reporting should have been that Bachmann edged out Ron Paul and forced Tim Pawlenty out of the race.

One clip I found remarkable had a reporter being told that he should skip covering Ron Paul's speech and try to get a video of Sarah Palin getting off her bus. I think people have already seen that Palin can get off her bus unassisted, but lots of folks have no idea what Ron Paul's ideas are.


I really don't worry too much about random anecdotes regarding individual reporters.

Yes, ***** happens
Yes, the amount of press coverage that Sarah Palin gets is ridiculous
For that matter, the amount of press coverage that Lady Gaga gets is even more silly

However, I don't think that the press is to blame that voters don't know Ron Paul's positions on topic XYZ...

Spend five minutes online and you can find enormous amounts of information about Ron Paul, ranging from Paul's own speeches to really good coverage on NPR, in the New York Review of Books, you name it.

TV news really isn't all that good a source of information...
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#31 User is offline   kenberg 

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Posted 2011-August-19, 12:42

To repeat, I found the clip hilarious. I am one of the few people I know that doesn't think Jon Stewart is all that funny but this one was great. No need to treat it too seriously. But if I were to do so:

1. The opening shots of reporters each repeating the phrases of each other should embarrass them at least a bit. I recall when Mitt Romney's father was trying to get the nomination. I can't count high enough to tell you the number of times I heard "George Romney, the man who said he was brainwashed..." A faculty colleague once told me of a student who handed in a photocopy of someone else's homework. When asked, he explained that he was on a tight schedule.

2. I think, or at least hope, that both Sarah Palin and Lady Gaga are yesterday's news at best. Although I caught a bit of Gaga once and actually she has a decent voice. It's the firecrackers in the crotch that I could do without.

3. I think it wouldn't have taken excessive effort for the press corps to find someone who could summarize Ron Paul's ideas and discuss his history as a candidate. Hell, they could interview Richard.

4. But of course Stewart is making a comedic point and he is selecting material to fit. I'm fine with that.

5. A Ron Paul supporter and his wife are coming over tomorrow. I think we are both under instructions from our wives not to discuss politics, but I really think I have to show him this clip.
Ken
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#32 User is offline   PassedOut 

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Posted 2011-August-19, 13:56

I accept what Richard says about TV news. Aside from breaking events like 9/11 and major speeches carried live, I don't watch it (except when I happen to see clips like those on the Daily Show).

For many years I've had a bone to pick with both TV and newspapers concerning the wasting of peoples' time. At least with newspapers you can skip articles, and you can scan the first paragraph or two to see if a whole article is worth reading. Can't do that with TV news.

Aside from the inane repetitions like the George Romney "brainwashed" quote Ken mentioned, there is a repeating sequence of reporting on TV and in newspapers that I can't stand. The sequence goes this way:

#1. Story after story about what is going to happen.
#2. One story about what did happen.
#3. Story after story about why what was going to happen did not happen.

Years ago I first noticed this pattern in reports about elections outside of the US. Then it spread like a drug-resistant infection.

#1 and #3 are complete time-wasters; only #2 is worth the time to read.

The searchable web is, in my opinion, the only half-way decent source for news these days. But the downside is the understandable tendency to search for material that reinforces one's current views. Fortunately discussion boards exist in which posters articulate contrary views without hesitation!
The growth of wisdom may be gauged exactly by the diminution of ill temper. — Friedrich Nietzsche
The infliction of cruelty with a good conscience is a delight to moralists — that is why they invented hell. — Bertrand Russell
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#33 User is offline   jonottawa 

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Posted 2011-August-19, 13:56

View PostWinstonm, on 2011-August-18, 17:15, said:

At what exact point in time did America lose its collective mind?


December, 1998? When the greatest president of all time was impeached because of a couple of blowjobs? (I'd say 1998 was the year America peaked and it's been in decline ever since. (Come to think of it, me too.))

November, 2000? When a near-plurality of us cast votes for an alcoholic cheerleader, religious zealot, and failed businessman, because his father was a dishonest 1-term president once.

December, 2000? When the supreme court decided that to count all the votes in Florida would deprive Dubya of his civil rights?

September 11, 2001? When we decided that in order to beat the terrorists we had to become just like them?

And I agree about the media coverage of Ron Paul. Absolutely disgraceful. The media is the message problem.
Of course, there is no doubt that if we lived in a police state, it would be easier to catch terrorists. If we lived in a country that allowed the police to search your home at any time for any reason; if we lived in a country that allowed the government to open your mail, eavesdrop on your phone conversations, or intercept your email communications; if we lived in a country that allowed the government to hold people in jail indefinitely based on what they write or think, or based on mere suspicion that they are up to no good, then the government would no doubt discover and arrest more terrorists. But that probably would not be a country in which we would want to live. And that would not be a country for which we could, in good conscience, ask our young people to fight and die. In short, that would not be America. ~ Russ Feingold
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#34 User is offline   blackshoe 

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Posted 2011-August-19, 15:11

View PostPassedOut, on 2011-August-19, 08:10, said:

One clip I found remarkable had a reporter being told that he should skip covering Ron Paul's speech and try to get a video of Sarah Palin getting off her bus. I think people have already seen that Palin can get off her bus unassisted, but lots of folks have no idea what Ron Paul's ideas are.


I don't know who the guy is who told that reporter that, but he clearly thinks Ron Paul is a non-entity. He's equally clearly no journalist. Frankly, if I were his boss, I'd fire him.
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#35 User is offline   PassedOut 

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Posted 2011-August-19, 16:40

View Postblackshoe, on 2011-August-19, 15:11, said:

I don't know who the guy is who told that reporter that, but he clearly thinks Ron Paul is a non-entity. He's equally clearly no journalist. Frankly, if I were his boss, I'd fire him.

My impression was that the reporter's news director gave that direction. The only news director that I have known enforced the policies of management on his reporters even when he disagreed with those policies. I'd like to be wrong on this one, but I fear that's really where we are these days.
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#36 User is offline   Mbodell 

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Posted 2011-August-19, 19:28

View PostPassedOut, on 2011-August-19, 16:40, said:

My impression was that the reporter's news director gave that direction. The only news director that I have known enforced the policies of management on his reporters even when he disagreed with those policies. I'd like to be wrong on this one, but I fear that's really where we are these days.


My impression is that it was the news anchor giving the instruction to the field reporter on the live news. It is pretty ridiculous. Not at all fair and balanced.
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#37 User is offline   Mbodell 

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Posted 2011-August-19, 19:33

View PostPassedOut, on 2011-August-19, 13:56, said:

For many years I've had a bone to pick with both TV and newspapers concerning the wasting of peoples' time. At least with newspapers you can skip articles, and you can scan the first paragraph or two to see if a whole article is worth reading. Can't do that with TV news.

Aside from the inane repetitions like the George Romney "brainwashed" quote Ken mentioned, there is a repeating sequence of reporting on TV and in newspapers that I can't stand. The sequence goes this way:

#1. Story after story about what is going to happen.
#2. One story about what did happen.
#3. Story after story about why what was going to happen did not happen.

Years ago I first noticed this pattern in reports about elections outside of the US. Then it spread like a drug-resistant infection.

#1 and #3 are complete time-wasters; only #2 is worth the time to read.


That's annoying, but what is worse IMO is the pattern of:

#1. There is some issue in the news.
#2. To report on the issue in a fair and impartial way here are two people to represent both sides of the issue.
#3. The news reporters/anchors do not report facts and just give the two people a soap box and don't correct them. On the "good" shows the hosts facilitate discussions. On the "bad" shows the hosts facilitate shouting matches.

Nobody cares if one of the people is actually representing the facts or the mainstream scientific community and the other is a lunatic. Nobody notices if both people ignore a large segment of the population because they are unrepresented by the usual D-R split. Nobody cares if the issue is actually complex and has more than two sides.

Report the facts. Don't let people get away with lies, distorted and misleading statements, or other propaganda.
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#38 User is offline   blackshoe 

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Posted 2011-August-19, 21:32

View PostMbodell, on 2011-August-19, 19:28, said:

My impression is that it was the news anchor giving the instruction to the field reporter on the live news. It is pretty ridiculous. Not at all fair and balanced.


Exactly. Note that the same guy appears elsewhere in the video, interviewing and/or doing the "anchor" thing.
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#39 User is offline   PassedOut 

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Posted 2011-August-19, 22:02

View Postblackshoe, on 2011-August-19, 21:32, said:

Exactly. Note that the same guy appears elsewhere in the video, interviewing and/or doing the "anchor" thing.

Yep. Looked at the video and you guys are right. Also right imo that it is appalling.
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#40 User is offline   Winstonm 

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Posted 2011-August-19, 22:05

View PostPassedOut, on 2011-August-19, 13:56, said:

I accept what Richard says about TV news. Aside from breaking events like 9/11 and major speeches carried live, I don't watch it (except when I happen to see clips like those on the Daily Show).

For many years I've had a bone to pick with both TV and newspapers concerning the wasting of peoples' time. At least with newspapers you can skip articles, and you can scan the first paragraph or two to see if a whole article is worth reading. Can't do that with TV news.

Aside from the inane repetitions like the George Romney "brainwashed" quote Ken mentioned, there is a repeating sequence of reporting on TV and in newspapers that I can't stand. The sequence goes this way:

#1. Story after story about what is going to happen.
#2. One story about what did happen.
#3. Story after story about why what was going to happen did not happen.

Years ago I first noticed this pattern in reports about elections outside of the US. Then it spread like a drug-resistant infection.

#1 and #3 are complete time-wasters; only #2 is worth the time to read.

The searchable web is, in my opinion, the only half-way decent source for news these days. But the downside is the understandable tendency to search for material that reinforces one's current views. Fortunately discussion boards exist in which posters articulate contrary views without hesitation!


Actually, this isn't the biggest concern to me. Glenn Greenwald has written extensively about and documented a much more troubling aspect of American journalism in that for the most part the "journalists" have become stenographers who simply repeat what some "so and so" on the inside had to say, and, of course, these insiders are always anonymous. It then follows this pattern:

1. Some un-named source gives an unchallenged, one-sided view which is reported as news.
2. Other news organizations retell the story, citing the initial unverified story as their source.
3. With enough retelling, the unverified, unchallenged, one-sided claim becomes accepted as "news".
"Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please."
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