BBO Discussion Forums: Would you go 2 over 1 F.G. with this? - BBO Discussion Forums

Jump to content

  • 3 Pages +
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • You cannot start a new topic
  • You cannot reply to this topic

Would you go 2 over 1 F.G. with this? Evaluation strikes again...

Poll: Would you bid 2 Clubs with this hand: (49 member(s) have cast votes)

Would you bid 2 Clubs with this hand:

  1. Yes (19 votes [38.78%])

    Percentage of vote: 38.78%

  2. No (26 votes [53.06%])

    Percentage of vote: 53.06%

  3. Depends on the vulnerability (2 votes [4.08%])

    Percentage of vote: 4.08%

  4. Something else (2 votes [4.08%])

    Percentage of vote: 4.08%

Vote Guests cannot vote

#1 User is offline   Hanoi5 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 4,080
  • Joined: 2006-August-31
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Santiago, Chile
  • Interests:Bridge, Video Games, Languages, Travelling.

Posted 2009-November-19, 07:14

You get:

♠Kx
♥KQxx
♦Jxx
♣Kxxx

Your partner opens 1♠ after the dealer passes, what's your bid?

View Postwyman, on 2012-May-04, 09:48, said:

Also, he rates to not have a heart void when he leads the ♥3.


View Postrbforster, on 2012-May-20, 21:04, said:

Besides playing for fun, most people also like to play bridge to win


My YouTube Channel
0

#2 User is offline   Free 

  • mmm Duvel
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 10,728
  • Joined: 2003-July-30
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Belgium
  • Interests:Duvel, Whisky

Posted 2009-November-19, 07:16

12+12 is GF...
"It may be rude to leave to go to the bathroom, but it's downright stupid to sit there and piss yourself" - blackshoe
0

#3 User is offline   mohitz 

  • PipPipPipPip
  • Group: Full Members
  • Posts: 357
  • Joined: 2008-May-19
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:India

Posted 2009-November-19, 07:18

All day long!
All your ace are belong to us!
0

#4 User is offline   mikegill 

  • PipPipPipPip
  • Group: Full Members
  • Posts: 296
  • Joined: 2006-May-26

Posted 2009-November-19, 07:20

I'm sure that at MPs or white IMPs I would just bid 1N. At red IMPs, I'm not sure I could bring myself to only invite game, but I would certainly want to.
0

#5 User is offline   billw55 

  • enigmatic
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 4,757
  • Joined: 2009-July-31
  • Gender:Male

Posted 2009-November-19, 07:39

Hmmm, flat, bad spots ... for me depends on partner's style. If he typically opens bad 11 counts, I will bid 1NT then invite. He will probably think of a decent 13 as a max and accept. And if he has that 11 count, we end up right where we belong.
Life is long and beautiful, if bad things happen, good things will follow.
-gwnn
0

#6 User is offline   Codo 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 6,373
  • Joined: 2003-March-15
  • Location:Hamburg, Germany
  • Interests:games and sports, esp. bridge,chess and (beach-)volleyball

Posted 2009-November-19, 07:48

All day long. If partner has a hand with just 11, he will have no crap, so we may still have play in game.
Kind Regards

Roland

Sanity Check: Failure (Fluffy)
More system is not the answer...
0

#7 User is offline   billw55 

  • enigmatic
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 4,757
  • Joined: 2009-July-31
  • Gender:Male

Posted 2009-November-19, 08:00

Codo, on Nov 19 2009, 08:48 AM, said:

All day long. If partner has a hand with just 11, he will have no crap, so we may still have play in game.

Exactly! If you have that partner, bid 2♣. But if you have the partner that frequently does have crap ...
Life is long and beautiful, if bad things happen, good things will follow.
-gwnn
0

#8 User is offline   kenrexford 

  • Brain Farts and Actual Farts Increasing with Age
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 9,586
  • Joined: 2005-September-21
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Lima, Allen County, North-West-Central Ohio, USA
  • Interests:www.limadbc.blogspot.com editor/contributor

Posted 2009-November-19, 08:01

No reason to GF, IMO.

Suppose I bid 1NT, forcing. If partner rebids 2NT or higher, no problem. If partner rebids 2♠ or 2♥, I could decide to GF now. If partner bids 2♦ or 2♣, I could choose to bid 3NT. But, if partner passes 1NT, he decided right.
"Gibberish in, gibberish out. A trial judge, three sets of lawyers, and now three appellate judges cannot agree on what this law means. And we ask police officers, prosecutors, defense lawyers, and citizens to enforce or abide by it? The legislature continues to write unreadable statutes. Gibberish should not be enforced as law."

-P.J. Painter.
0

#9 User is offline   inquiry 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Admin
  • Posts: 14,566
  • Joined: 2003-February-13
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Amelia Island, FL
  • Interests:Bridge, what else?

Posted 2009-November-19, 08:33

25 Zars, no known fit. I would not 2/1 GF with this one with my normal partners who tend to open light. I would make a 2/1 with my mother who will have a solid opener if she opens, and with other partners who do the same.
--Ben--

#10 User is offline   andy_h 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 1,962
  • Joined: 2007-September-14
  • Location:Australia
  • Interests:The Universe, Traveling, Squash, and Scandinavia.

Posted 2009-November-19, 08:44

Slightly depends on partner's style of openings. Generally I wouldn't GF as this hand is aceless with a stray jack. If my hand was Kxx KQxx Jx Kxxx then I would as we have a known fit. I'll start off with 1NT and I'm still allowed to re-evaluate depending on partner's rebid.
- Andy -

We are all connected to each other biologically, to the Earth chemically, and to the rest of the universe atomically.
We're in the universe, and the universe is in us.
0

#11 User is offline   pooltuna 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 3,814
  • Joined: 2009-July-23
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:New Orleans

Posted 2009-November-19, 08:47

billw55, on Nov 19 2009, 09:00 AM, said:

Codo, on Nov 19 2009, 08:48 AM, said:

All day long. If partner has a hand with just 11, he will have no crap, so we may still have play in game.

Exactly! If you have that partner, bid 2♣. But if you have the partner that frequently does have crap ...

The partner with the crap rebids 2♠ over 2♣ and passes your 2NT call
"Tell me of your home world, Usul"
the Freman, Chani from the move "Dune"

"I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it."

George Bernard Shaw
0

#12 User is offline   gnasher 

  • Andy Bowles
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 11,993
  • Joined: 2007-May-03
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:London, UK

Posted 2009-November-19, 09:03

Agree with Ken.

Help!
... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
0

#13 User is offline   dake50 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 2,211
  • Joined: 2006-April-22

Posted 2009-November-19, 09:04

Not 2C but 2D. Next 2N >2S looks just right.
0

#14 User is offline   helene_t 

  • The Abbess
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 17,087
  • Joined: 2004-April-22
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:UK

Posted 2009-November-19, 09:11

Disagree with Ken. 1NT followed by 3NT should be reserved for hands that upgrade due to opener's rebid, or are too quacky to give p the impression of hiving the slam potential that usually goes with GF hands.

This depends on partner's opening style, I suppose with an unknown p I would GF.
The world would be such a happy place, if only everyone played Acol :) --- TramTicket
0

#15 User is offline   mikeh 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 12,854
  • Joined: 2005-June-15
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Canada
  • Interests:Bridge, golf, wine (red), cooking, reading eclectically but insatiably, travelling, making bad posts.

Posted 2009-November-19, 09:23

kenrexford, on Nov 19 2009, 09:01 AM, said:

No reason to GF, IMO.

Suppose I bid 1NT, forcing.  If partner rebids 2NT or higher, no problem.  If partner rebids 2♠ or 2♥, I could decide to GF now.  If partner bids 2♦ or 2♣, I could choose to bid 3NT.  But, if partner passes 1NT, he decided right.

The OP suggested that 2/1 is gf...that method ALWAYS (to my knowledge) means that 1N is F1. Therefore opener will never pass 1N unless he has psyched.

Having said that, I agree with Gnasher's post (all of it)

Helene: arguing that 1N 3N should be reserved for hands that have upgraded is not, imo, accurate. Another reason for 1N then 3N is to warn partner, who may be looking at a hand just under jumpshift values, NOT to get excited, as he surely would were we to gf immediately. Thus I (and others) will sometimes respond 1N or make a limit bergen raise on hands where we, as responder, are always intending to bid game but don't want partner to become too aggressive on good hands. These hands are usually very 'soft', as is the one under consideration.
'one of the great markers of the advance of human kindness is the howls you will hear from the Men of God' Johann Hari
0

#16 User is offline   hanp 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 2,987
  • Joined: 2009-February-15

Posted 2009-November-19, 09:29

I think it is very common to play 2/1 gameforcing and 1NT not forcing.

I also agree with the onenotrumpers, though less comfortably so red at IMPs.
and the result can be plotted on a graph.
0

#17 User is offline   miguelm 

  • PipPipPipPip
  • Group: Full Members
  • Posts: 132
  • Joined: 2008-January-03

Posted 2009-November-19, 10:06

Everything Mikeh wrote :)
It all makes perfect sense, expressed in dollars and cents.
0

#18 User is offline   jdonn 

  • - - T98765432 AQT8
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 15,085
  • Joined: 2005-June-23
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Las Vegas, NV

Posted 2009-November-19, 10:25

1NT!!! I saw it started off nearly unanimous for a game force and nearly puked in my mouth.
Please let me know about any questions or interest or bug reports about GIB.
0

#19 User is offline   billw55 

  • enigmatic
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 4,757
  • Joined: 2009-July-31
  • Gender:Male

Posted 2009-November-19, 10:27

pooltuna, on Nov 19 2009, 09:47 AM, said:

billw55, on Nov 19 2009, 09:00 AM, said:

Codo, on Nov 19 2009, 08:48 AM, said:

All day long. If partner has a hand with just 11, he will have no crap, so we may still have play in game.

Exactly! If you have that partner, bid 2♣. But if you have the partner that frequently does have crap ...

The partner with the crap rebids 2♠ over 2♣ and passes your 2NT call

Well if 2♣ is game forcing that's not really an option ;)
Life is long and beautiful, if bad things happen, good things will follow.
-gwnn
0

#20 User is offline   Phil 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 10,092
  • Joined: 2008-December-11
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:North Texas, USA
  • Interests:Mountain Biking

Posted 2009-November-19, 10:54

jdonn, on Nov 19 2009, 11:25 AM, said:

1NT!!! I saw it started off nearly unanimous for a game force and nearly puked in my mouth.

Josh you should know by now being an underbidder on the forums is a fate worse than death. Underbidders must where a scarlet "U" on their foreheads. Mine is permanently stained.

1N is very easy. In many continuations I will GF this. In others I will simply invite.

When is a balanced, aceless 12 ever a game force?

When the "an opening bid facing an opening bid produces game" theorem was introduced, people were passing these hands.

Quote

...puked in my mouth


Prilosec helps with this.
Hi y'all!

Winner - BBO Challenge bracket #6 - February, 2017.
0
  • 3 Pages +
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • You cannot start a new topic
  • You cannot reply to this topic

1 User(s) are reading this topic
0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users