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A Simple Question?

Poll: Your call? (26 member(s) have cast votes)

Your call?

  1. Double (7 votes [26.92%])

    Percentage of vote: 26.92%

  2. 3D (8 votes [30.77%])

    Percentage of vote: 30.77%

  3. Other (11 votes [42.31%])

    Percentage of vote: 42.31%

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#21 User is offline   SoTired 

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Posted 2006-December-20, 08:18

No Dbl: Not without spades

Over a 1-level bid, a jump is preemptive and a q-bid is Michaels, so with a strong hand you must start with a double.

Over a preempt, the jump bid is no longer preemptive (remember: Don't preempt over a preempt). Some play the jump as a 2-suiter, but since this is the BI section, you probably don't play that convention.

So the good (BI) bid is 4D, showing a hand too strong for 3D.

If partner bids 5D, raise to 6D. If partner bids 4H, raise to 6H. If partner bids 4S, try 5D.

As a side note, preemptive bidding is difficult, even for experts. An old rule still applies: If you have to lie about either strength or distribution, lie about distribution, never strength. The corrallary to that is: If you can show either proper strength or distribution, show the strength. Applying that to this hand, 3D preserves finding a possible heart fit, but hides the strength of the hand. 4D shows the hand strength, but may lose the heart suit. Double tries to preserve the heart suit, delays showing the strength and possibly confuses partner about your spade tolerance.

Seems like 4D is the obvious choice.
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#22 User is offline   Halo 

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Posted 2006-December-20, 10:48

4D. Good hand with a lot of diamonds.
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#23 User is offline   Gerben42 

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Posted 2006-December-21, 07:29

3: Good hand with lots of .

You won't get anything close to agreement on hands like this. Any of the reasonable bids might work at some times and be terrible at others. In fact this is also true for some unreasonable bids :P
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#24 User is offline   mikeh 

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Posted 2006-December-21, 11:19

I agree with the comments that this hand should be discussed without reference to (or, perhaps more accurately) use of conventional devices unlikely to be playable by those for whom this thread is intended.

So we get to discuss the merits and demerits of alternative 'natural' calls.

It seems to me that we have a large number of options here, which is bound to make this type of hand tough even for experts: if a B-I player should get anything from this discussion it is just that: unusual hands over preempts are difficult to deal with, since all calls violate some fundamental principle.

Pass: cannot be done. It might work the best: all other active calls carry a risk of diaster, but bridge is a bidder's game. This hand has too much upside: we may be cold for a grand slam! Pass is an abdication of your responsibility in the partnership.

3: well, the good news about 3 is that you will probably make B) . Actually, there is more to it than that. 3 is not a display of weakness: take away one King from your hand and I think that 3 would be the overwhelming choice of an expert panel. So 3 is an underbid, but that is its only real downside. On the upside: 3 may well find someone, LHO or partner, able to bid 3. If partner bids 3, we will get to 3N.... of course 3N may not be the best spot, but partner, with a good fit for s and a stiff or void may move again.... and a suit slam probably requires him to hold very short s. I would not hold my breath waiting for partner to bid 3: no partner is advancing 3 inot s on a Jxxx or Jxxxx suit.

If we bid 3 and LHO bids 3 (unlikely... he won't have the hcp to do so without a fit, and our s suggest he doesn't have that fit), we can get back into the auction either via a voluntary 4 or (over 4) 4N... if we choose to be aggressive.


double: this is a traditional call with a hand too good to overcall and our 18 hcp is on the high end for overcalls in old-school bidding. Most experts today will not double unless they are prepared for what partner may do. Here is the nub of the matter: is this hand within the expectancy of an expert partner if we were to pull 4 to 5? As some have said, today few experts play that double of a preempt and then our suit is a pure one-suiter. Pure one-suiters can usually be shown by natural, direct bids, bearing in mind the saying that one does not preempt over a preempt: over a preempt, the more we bid, the more we have.

So double followed by 5 shows a 'flexible' hand... if you want to sound like an expert, use 'flexible' a lot in discussing why you chose a particular call.

But is this what we think of in terms of flexible? Not for me: flexible (to me) says that I can tolerate s... I have a long, strong suit, but partner, with say 6=3=1=3 can and should return to s! I would be typically something like 2=3=6=2 or 2=4=6=1 with say Kx of as my worst holding.

3: no-one has spoken of this bid, and the reasons are clear, but while I don't advocate it, we should consider the call. It may lead to a good 4-3 or 4-4 fit: and we will rarely find the suit if we don't bid it. But it is a bit too weird for a BI (or an expert) to choose it

3N: well.. a direct route to the most likely game, but such a distortion. It also risks partner insisting on s. So this is out.

4: not a preempt: a powerful one-suiter. Problem: we have a 2-suiter, and our s are not very strong... strong, yes, but not as strong as we would usually hold for this call.


Okay, we've seen that all calls are flawed. My choice of distortion: 3. If I get by this round, I am going to be okay. BTW, I have scored more minor suit 170s (and the odd 190) than most B)
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#25 User is offline   mike777 

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Posted 2006-December-21, 17:43

"If I get by this round, I am going to be okay"


My stealing of Dr. Roth on so many problem hands. :P

OK thanks for all the great feedback...I guess my choice was not that simple as my partner impied at the time. :P
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#26 User is offline   the hog 

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Posted 2006-December-21, 18:17

mike777, on Dec 22 2006, 09:43 AM, said:

"If I get by this round, I am going to be okay"


My stealing of Dr. Roth on so many problem hands. :P

OK thanks for all the great feedback...I guess my choice was not that simple as my partner impied at the time. :P

As a matter of interest Mike, what DID your partner imply at the time? I'm curious.
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#27 User is offline   mike777 

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Posted 2006-December-21, 18:22

He thought I should double.

I thought about it but bid 3D at the table...making 6 with 3 overtricks. One of 3 missed slams out of 12 deals.
4D would be undiscussed.
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